beercia
Mechanical
- Jul 11, 2003
- 36
Is it worth it?
Tek-Tips is the largest IT community on the Internet today!
Members share and learn making Tek-Tips Forums the best source of peer-reviewed technical information on the Internet!
-
Congratulations MintJulep on being selected by the Eng-Tips community for having the most helpful posts in the forums last week. Way to Go!
I want upgrade to Mathcad 11 from Mathcad 2000
- Thread starter beercia
- Start date
- Status
2001i was worth it, 11 isn't.
The main bug-bear is the activation (similar to Windows XP) This essentially installs the 'spyware' (called SafeCast) on your computer.
The additional features, IMHO, are not worth the money. I upgraded and have now gone back to 2001i, mainly due to the activation issue. I really like Mathcad as an engineering tool but I will not be upgrading in future.
The main bug-bear is the activation (similar to Windows XP) This essentially installs the 'spyware' (called SafeCast) on your computer.
The additional features, IMHO, are not worth the money. I upgraded and have now gone back to 2001i, mainly due to the activation issue. I really like Mathcad as an engineering tool but I will not be upgrading in future.
- Thread starter
- #6
Like I said it depends on what you're doing, mathwise.
There are a bunch of recalcitrants ;-) still running v7, so it's very possible that you might not need to upgrade. If you've looked at the feature list on the Mathsoft website and nothing grabs you, then it's probably not worth the extra expense.
TTFN
There are a bunch of recalcitrants ;-) still running v7, so it's very possible that you might not need to upgrade. If you've looked at the feature list on the Mathsoft website and nothing grabs you, then it's probably not worth the extra expense.
TTFN
I understand that C_DILLA is part of the activation system but does it really have to take up 1.2Mb on my computer.
Download and run a free program called Spybot and see what that turns up!
It is unfortunate that software is starting down this route. I have no pirated software and as a professional engineer would never dream of using it. I would prefer a hardlock route to software protection.
Download and run a free program called Spybot and see what that turns up!
It is unfortunate that software is starting down this route. I have no pirated software and as a professional engineer would never dream of using it. I would prefer a hardlock route to software protection.
I'm still using V5! Generally quite happy with it, and it gets the job done. Some limitations are annoying, such as the default unit systems, and the graphing is limited. If all you want to do is crunch numbers, the version you have doesn't matter.
STF
STF
GregLocock
Automotive
Do I win some sort of medal? - I use v4 !
We had 5+ at my last place of work, it was much better than v4. I had a play with 2001, I liked the programming features, but hated the interface. I seemed to have to retype every equation (but I hadn't done the tutorial so it was probably my fault).
A combination of Mathcad and Excel with VBA solves all of my mathematical needs.
Cheers
Greg Locock
We had 5+ at my last place of work, it was much better than v4. I had a play with 2001, I liked the programming features, but hated the interface. I seemed to have to retype every equation (but I hadn't done the tutorial so it was probably my fault).
A combination of Mathcad and Excel with VBA solves all of my mathematical needs.
Cheers
Greg Locock
The only reason I upgraded was because we needed a new licence, and 2000 pro was no longer available. Downsidesare that
1] I have to explicitly save everything in 2000 format (because the rest of the section is still on 2000, and my budget doesn't stretch to upgrading them as well just because I need one more licence), and
2] mathconnex has vanished.
Seems I now have to by VisSim if I want mathconnex functionality - ie more $$$ for something I got for nix before. So the upgrade wasn't really, it was more a downgrade.
But I must confess I hadn't done anything too critical using mathconnex, and many of the features in v11 overcome some of the difficulties - sliders, buttons, and other such things are much more easily put directly into worksheets now.
Bung
Life is non-linear...
1] I have to explicitly save everything in 2000 format (because the rest of the section is still on 2000, and my budget doesn't stretch to upgrading them as well just because I need one more licence), and
2] mathconnex has vanished.
Seems I now have to by VisSim if I want mathconnex functionality - ie more $$$ for something I got for nix before. So the upgrade wasn't really, it was more a downgrade.
But I must confess I hadn't done anything too critical using mathconnex, and many of the features in v11 overcome some of the difficulties - sliders, buttons, and other such things are much more easily put directly into worksheets now.
Bung
Life is non-linear...
IRStuff & AJUK :
Follows a copy of ltr. sent to Mathsoft's Allen Radzow, Senior Vice President of Products and Services, re: the subject of Product Activation, relating the bad experience that INTUIT had with its inclusion in their TurboTax product last year. It cost them a significant loss of revenue as people were not buying it and many of those that did, returned it, with complaint, for a $$$ refund They have removed from this year's product, and wrote a letter appology to their customers.
Consumer revolt that impacts the "bottom line" is still the most effective way to get the message across.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[ul]Dear Allen,
The folks at Intuit were slow to learn that their users were extremely annoyed at the "Product Activation" technology imbedded in their TurboTax program last year. They were annoyed to the point of returning the product for full refund, vowing never to use the product again, and, filing a Class- Action lawsuit. The worst sin was....that it affected their "bottom line" sales numbers; which suffered a major decline from preceding years.
This same technology is employed in your current Mathcad product.
Perhaps you could profit and learn from other's mistakes and in so doing, re-examine the Mathsoft policy that places this abhorent technology in your products thus preventing me and other Mathsoft users from using their products both at home and at their offices.
You will find the article at the link below, including the mention of the fact that Tom Allanson, senior vice president of Intuit's consumer tax group, wrote an open letter of appology to TurboTax customers on Thursday.
[ignore][/ignore][/ul]
Follows a copy of ltr. sent to Mathsoft's Allen Radzow, Senior Vice President of Products and Services, re: the subject of Product Activation, relating the bad experience that INTUIT had with its inclusion in their TurboTax product last year. It cost them a significant loss of revenue as people were not buying it and many of those that did, returned it, with complaint, for a $$$ refund They have removed from this year's product, and wrote a letter appology to their customers.
Consumer revolt that impacts the "bottom line" is still the most effective way to get the message across.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[ul]Dear Allen,
The folks at Intuit were slow to learn that their users were extremely annoyed at the "Product Activation" technology imbedded in their TurboTax program last year. They were annoyed to the point of returning the product for full refund, vowing never to use the product again, and, filing a Class- Action lawsuit. The worst sin was....that it affected their "bottom line" sales numbers; which suffered a major decline from preceding years.
This same technology is employed in your current Mathcad product.
Perhaps you could profit and learn from other's mistakes and in so doing, re-examine the Mathsoft policy that places this abhorent technology in your products thus preventing me and other Mathsoft users from using their products both at home and at their offices.
You will find the article at the link below, including the mention of the fact that Tom Allanson, senior vice president of Intuit's consumer tax group, wrote an open letter of appology to TurboTax customers on Thursday.
[ignore][/ignore][/ul]
IRSTUFF & AJUK:
Just after I posted, I received a reply from Allen Radzow at Mathsoft.
Allen advises that they are indeed concerned about the "Product Activation" issue. He goes on to say that, "Mathsoft acknowledges the problems some users experience, and the deep distaste for activation felt by some users."
Their Product Management Organization is at this time gathering input and data on this in consideration of their next release.
This is a good time to make your voice heard if you find 'Product Activation' distasteful or an impediment to future consideration and purchase of their products.
Allen Radzow: aradzow@mathsoft.com
IRSTUFF:
As a software developer, I have a poignant appreciation for the software piracy problem... but "throwing the baby out with the bathwater"...so to speak, is not a viable solution.
Just after I posted, I received a reply from Allen Radzow at Mathsoft.
Allen advises that they are indeed concerned about the "Product Activation" issue. He goes on to say that, "Mathsoft acknowledges the problems some users experience, and the deep distaste for activation felt by some users."
Their Product Management Organization is at this time gathering input and data on this in consideration of their next release.
This is a good time to make your voice heard if you find 'Product Activation' distasteful or an impediment to future consideration and purchase of their products.
Allen Radzow: aradzow@mathsoft.com
IRSTUFF:
As a software developer, I have a poignant appreciation for the software piracy problem... but "throwing the baby out with the bathwater"...so to speak, is not a viable solution.
- Thread starter
- #16
beercia
Mechanical
- Jul 11, 2003
- 36
At the time i started this thread I was seriously considering buying the upgrade but after learning of the activation feature I will not upgrade. It is not a matter of piracy but of convenience. That is one of the reasons I haven't upgraded to Windows XP ( I don't agree with the Microsoft policy of serializing the software to your computer components making it almost impossible to upgrade components unless you buy a new license and I consider this abusive and unfair) I rather prefer to make the move to Linux and use the Windows 98 SE platform only to run programs as long as I can avoid the upgrade to whatever comes after XP). The Microsoft protection scheme in Windows 98 is bad enough for me to be fed up with all their software and their faulty programs that fail to recognize time after time the originals from the pirated copies ( and their faulty security flaws also) I think the protection schemes are getting to the point of rendering computers useless because you spend more time fixing hard disks, reinstalling programs, installing security patches and restarting your computer after frezee-ups than using it on productive work.
It is a senseless activity. Ahaaaa how much I miss the good old days of true computer liberty...
It is a senseless activity. Ahaaaa how much I miss the good old days of true computer liberty...
GregLocock
Automotive
Well, why not go to a proper operating system like Windows 2000?
It is stable and has no product activation. My workstation at work has uptimes of the order of weeks, usually limited by the company I work for which insists we re-boot after various updates.
Unfortunately Linux lacks an Office compatible spreadsheet, (yesterday I watched open office take 5 minutes to open a spreadsheet that consisted of 100 short columns added up, for the most part and then crash) and of course Mathcad is not available for Linux, and doesn't seem to work under WINE.
And I'm sure if you think back you will accept that modern PCs running modern OSs are MUCH more reliable than they were 10 years ago.
Cheers
Greg Locock
It is stable and has no product activation. My workstation at work has uptimes of the order of weeks, usually limited by the company I work for which insists we re-boot after various updates.
Unfortunately Linux lacks an Office compatible spreadsheet, (yesterday I watched open office take 5 minutes to open a spreadsheet that consisted of 100 short columns added up, for the most part and then crash) and of course Mathcad is not available for Linux, and doesn't seem to work under WINE.
And I'm sure if you think back you will accept that modern PCs running modern OSs are MUCH more reliable than they were 10 years ago.
Cheers
Greg Locock
I agree with GregLocock, Windows 2000 will be the last OS I buy from Micro$oft. As Linux develops I hope that more professional level software, such as Mathcad, will become available. If so, I would switch tommorrow.
jOmega, thanks for the information regarding Mathsofts' position. It's very interesting and it restores my faith in them, they seem to be listening to their customers, unlike Micro$oft!
If the activation is removed from the next version, I will upgrade, if it is still included then I will stick with 2001i, it's as simple as that.
Regards
AJUK
jOmega, thanks for the information regarding Mathsofts' position. It's very interesting and it restores my faith in them, they seem to be listening to their customers, unlike Micro$oft!
If the activation is removed from the next version, I will upgrade, if it is still included then I will stick with 2001i, it's as simple as that.
Regards
AJUK
- Thread starter
- #19
beercia
Mechanical
- Jul 11, 2003
- 36
You see, I have determined that in my case Windows 98 SE is more or less stable as long I don't use it for surfing the web and accessing the Microsoft web page to download upgrades and patches (sometimes just accessing it!). My copy is original but it keeps crashing time after time corrupting itself and constantly giving me messages of "this program has performed an illegal operation" and sometimes freezing up dead on its tracks. I have 512 MB memory and have memory problems loading web pages and applications with only 4 or 5 resident programs installed (nothing big, just mouse utilities, keyboard and firewall). This has happened to me with either 512 MB and 256 MB memory so it is not a matter of memory running out. I had to make countless hard disk low level formats and Windows reinstalls to regain control and stability for some time then it happens again. At present I'm in the verge of a new one since Windows is misbehaving again (frequent frezee-ups, frequent messages, frequent blue screens of death, etc).
Linux would give the best of both worlds since I can use it for only surfing and then use Windows only for running applications that demand it since Linux allows the installation of additional OS. The problem here is Microsoft's predatory tactics to protect their buggy and poorly finished OS ( DOS with all its limitations was a lot more stable than whatever Windows has ever been, but then, DOS was not a true Microsoft program, was somebody else's brain child). As far I have seen, Microsoft has failed miserably in delivering a true stable and secure OS platform, version after version (just think of the many "security flaws" we have come to witness).
By the way, has anybody given any thought of what would happen if any software manufacturer could have unauthorized access to the PC's Intel processor serial number without the PC owner knowing it? Would that be the type of copy protection that some software manufacturers are choosing to do linking their software to the processor's serial number ? I certainly wouldn't like to buy any software that has this type of protection if it exists. In a sense, at present I wouldn't buy any Mathsoft upgrade until they deal with this issue and give us a better product. I agree that the computer hardware lock is a good alternative albeit more expensive.
Linux would give the best of both worlds since I can use it for only surfing and then use Windows only for running applications that demand it since Linux allows the installation of additional OS. The problem here is Microsoft's predatory tactics to protect their buggy and poorly finished OS ( DOS with all its limitations was a lot more stable than whatever Windows has ever been, but then, DOS was not a true Microsoft program, was somebody else's brain child). As far I have seen, Microsoft has failed miserably in delivering a true stable and secure OS platform, version after version (just think of the many "security flaws" we have come to witness).
By the way, has anybody given any thought of what would happen if any software manufacturer could have unauthorized access to the PC's Intel processor serial number without the PC owner knowing it? Would that be the type of copy protection that some software manufacturers are choosing to do linking their software to the processor's serial number ? I certainly wouldn't like to buy any software that has this type of protection if it exists. In a sense, at present I wouldn't buy any Mathsoft upgrade until they deal with this issue and give us a better product. I agree that the computer hardware lock is a good alternative albeit more expensive.
GregLocock
Automotive
You have too much memory for 98SE! Try 128 or 256 M again. You /may/ be able to disable the extra RAM by setting up a DOS RAM drive which you can then use as a swap file (the last is wild speculation).
Incidentally, I was wrong, Mathcad v4 seems to run fine under WINE/KDE/Knoppix 3.2. It took perhaps 5 minutes to get going (I was bored waiting for it so didn't notice when it sprang to life) but once it did then it seemed to work fine, although I didn't stress it very much. Incidentally, unlike the screenshots on the WINE webpage, it renders properly. I am quite impressed.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Incidentally, I was wrong, Mathcad v4 seems to run fine under WINE/KDE/Knoppix 3.2. It took perhaps 5 minutes to get going (I was bored waiting for it so didn't notice when it sprang to life) but once it did then it seemed to work fine, although I didn't stress it very much. Incidentally, unlike the screenshots on the WINE webpage, it renders properly. I am quite impressed.
Cheers
Greg Locock
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Question