Contact US

Log In

Come Join Us!

Are you an
Engineering professional?
Join Eng-Tips Forums!
  • Talk With Other Members
  • Be Notified Of Responses
    To Your Posts
  • Keyword Search
  • One-Click Access To Your
    Favorite Forums
  • Automated Signatures
    On Your Posts
  • Best Of All, It's Free!

*Eng-Tips's functionality depends on members receiving e-mail. By joining you are opting in to receive e-mail.

Posting Guidelines

Promoting, selling, recruiting, coursework and thesis posting is forbidden.

Students Click Here

HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

Hi All!!

Is there a way to exfiltrate a volume from the pond routing instead of the given parameters (conductivity, flow and velocity)?

Background: We have computed our net runoff volume that needs to be infiltrated in our ponds. The volume reduction is limited to 6 hours of infiltration only. As far as I can tell, HydroCAD uses the conductivity rate over the entire storm duration and results in higher infiltration volumes than targeted.

Thanks! Lisa

RE: HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

HydroCAD is intended for the simulation of real-world drainage systems. As such, there is no direct mechanism that would cause the exfiltration to artificially stop after an arbitrary 6 hour period. Although this may be the maximum exfiltration allowed by your stormwater regulations, the actual system will continue to exfiltrate throughout the entire storm.

However, you might be able to induce the cutoff by routing an exfiltration outlet (perhaps an orifice) to a link with a manual elevation table. The table can be used to define a tailwater that suddenly increases after 6 hours, thereby turning off the exfiltration outlet.

FYI, there are other outlet options that could be used to start the exfiltration at a specific time (including a pump, dam breach, or siphon) but getting the flow to stop as the WSE in the pond is still rising is more difficult. In reality, this just isn't going to happen.

Peter Smart
HydroCAD Software

RE: HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

Thanks psmart! The theory of the 6 hour limitation is that the soil would reach saturation after this amount of time and the infiltration rate is reduced. I was hopeful that we could get the discarded value to be equal or close to the 6 hr calc.

RE: HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

What's the municipality? Just curious.

Hydrology, Drainage Analysis, Flood Studies, and Complex Stormwater Litigation for Atlanta and the South East - http://www.campbellcivil.com

RE: HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

Pennsylvania - PADEP BMP Manual. The 6 hour time period is buried in an example, but it was recently brought to our attention that the infiltration volume calculation should be infiltration rate * infiltration area * infiltration period (assume 6 hours) * (1/12 ft/in) (PADEP BMP Manual Appendix D). We can't use the exfiltration discarded volume from HydroCAD because of this standard.

RE: HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

Just curious, when does the 6 hour time period start? If you start at zero hour with a 24-hour storm, there will be minimal runoff in the first 6 hours (depending on the CN), so any exfiltration is going to have very little effect on the overall pond routing. Exfiltration is more effective in handling low-depth events (like a 1" rainfall), where is can be expected to handle a larger fraction (perhaps all) of the event. In this situation cutting off the exfiltration makes no sense.

I know it's generally futile to argue with the regulations, but something doesn't seem right here.

Peter Smart
HydroCAD Software

RE: HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

That's a good point. There's very little to no runoff in the first six hours of a 24 hour distribution.

Hydrology, Drainage Analysis, Flood Studies, and Complex Stormwater Litigation for Atlanta and the South East - http://www.campbellcivil.com

RE: HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

The regs don't specify a particular 6 hour time period in the storm and the simple calculation doesn't take into account the hydrograph, storage, anything. We are having a hard time digesting this comment as well. In the end, the infiltration volume computed with the six hour period is isolated to a particular worksheet in the NPDES permit. After a run through of a few basin calculations, it hasn't effected the designs so we are just going with it.

You're right psmart! I don't argue the regs, I just try to bend to them. HA!

RE: HydroCAD Exfiltrate Volume

I am not familiar with PA, but just looked at the manual.

For an Infiltration Trench, section 6.4.4 states "*Infiltration Period is the time when bed is receiving runoff and capable of infiltration. Not to exceed 72 hours. "

The trench is used as an example in Appendix D where they "assume 6 hours". If one has infiltration testing that saturates the soil and then runs for a longer time, one should be able to justify periods supported by the site testing (up to 72h).

For an Infiltration Basin, section 6.4.2 states "*Infiltration Period is equal to 2 hours or tne time of concentration, whichever is larger. "

Red Flag This Post

Please let us know here why this post is inappropriate. Reasons such as off-topic, duplicates, flames, illegal, vulgar, or students posting their homework.

Red Flag Submitted

Thank you for helping keep Eng-Tips Forums free from inappropriate posts.
The Eng-Tips staff will check this out and take appropriate action.

Reply To This Thread

Posting in the Eng-Tips forums is a member-only feature.

Click Here to join Eng-Tips and talk with other members! Already a Member? Login


Close Box

Join Eng-Tips® Today!

Join your peers on the Internet's largest technical engineering professional community.
It's easy to join and it's free.

Here's Why Members Love Eng-Tips Forums:

Register now while it's still free!

Already a member? Close this window and log in.

Join Us             Close