cinnamongirl
Mechanical
I know what a workstation graphics card is, but what differentiates the motherboards in workstations made by HP and Dell? And which "à la carte" motherboards fit into this category that you would recommend?
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What makes a motherboard a workstation motherboard?
- Thread starter cinnamongirl
- Start date
- Status
dedevo
Mechanical
- Dec 3, 2010
- 54
Motherboards are the backbone of your system.
As for recommendations; I assume to run SW.
"à la carte" I'd be careful with HP and Dell. They typically sell off-the-shelf ("à la carte") catered towards the home user: e-mail, web browsing, word processing... Not good for SW.
Devon Murray, EIT [Mechanical]
Solidworks 2011 SP 2.0
As for recommendations; I assume to run SW.
"à la carte" I'd be careful with HP and Dell. They typically sell off-the-shelf ("à la carte") catered towards the home user: e-mail, web browsing, word processing... Not good for SW.
Devon Murray, EIT [Mechanical]
Solidworks 2011 SP 2.0
StrykerTECH
Mechanical
A "workstation" motherboard is generally a different socket style for the CPU. This way the motherboard is somewhat of a hybrid it uses a server class Xeon processor with high cache levels as oppose to an simple core 2 duo or core 2 quad. Eitherway I wouldn't get caught up in the lingo, it just means you have the ability to squeeze out a little more Horse Power from your system.
StrykerTECH Engineering Staff
Milwaukee, WI
StrykerTECH Engineering Staff
Milwaukee, WI
Judging from the Punch Holder benchmarking there isn't much distinction. There are gaming motherboards performing much better than workstation motherboards.
Core2 is last year's CPU. i5 and i7s are the current CPUs to have for best performance. Xeon does nothing for SW that an i7 won't do. It isn't so much how much cache there is as it is how fast the cores can talk to each other and to the cache. It's a new bottleneck brought on by high numbers of cores. Whether it is an i7 or a Xeon, to basic chip is the same architecture. I believe the current top of the line is Sandy Bridge. You will see both Desktop and Server cores use this architecture. If you look at the chart the current crop of cores have 8Mb L3 whether workstation or server (Xeon).
In a workstation you expect good IO, no scrimping on the quality of components. Arguably Boxx makes the best store bought workstations performance wise. A workstation builder will balance the motherboard, ram, cpu, graphics card and peripherals to favor the type of load CAD software creates. In addition a good workstation will have capacity for a lot of ram and excellent cooling. At SWW they even had a workstation that submerged the entire motherboard in circulating oil to keep it cool. A workstation builder might even have special drivers for the chip sets.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
Core2 is last year's CPU. i5 and i7s are the current CPUs to have for best performance. Xeon does nothing for SW that an i7 won't do. It isn't so much how much cache there is as it is how fast the cores can talk to each other and to the cache. It's a new bottleneck brought on by high numbers of cores. Whether it is an i7 or a Xeon, to basic chip is the same architecture. I believe the current top of the line is Sandy Bridge. You will see both Desktop and Server cores use this architecture. If you look at the chart the current crop of cores have 8Mb L3 whether workstation or server (Xeon).
In a workstation you expect good IO, no scrimping on the quality of components. Arguably Boxx makes the best store bought workstations performance wise. A workstation builder will balance the motherboard, ram, cpu, graphics card and peripherals to favor the type of load CAD software creates. In addition a good workstation will have capacity for a lot of ram and excellent cooling. At SWW they even had a workstation that submerged the entire motherboard in circulating oil to keep it cool. A workstation builder might even have special drivers for the chip sets.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
- Thread starter
- #5
cinnamongirl
Mechanical
Thanks for the replies. Yes, I know what a motherboard is, I just wanted to know what options are out there for building your own "workstation"-grade PC. HP and Dell make good workstations that come configured with powerful graphics cards geared for SolidWorks, but I wanted to find out if there are other specs that define a workstation. Of course, Xeon processors is one, but I would like to stay within an i5 or i7 budget.
You won't go wrong with an i5 or i7. You can find hundreds of benchmark results on a plethora of different workstation configurations here.
I just built a workstation using the AMD Phenom II 1100T that competes with lower end i7s and high end overclocked Core2 Intel CPUs for around $1,100. Of course if you want bleeding edge performance wait a bit for the Ivy-Bridge cores to come out from Intel.
There is another point to be learned from the Punch Holder benchmark. That benchmark ran in about 300 seconds on my old machine. By correcting some modeling errors and using different modeling techniques I was able to get it to rebuild in around 20 seconds. The moral of this is that using your head is worth more than a $4,000 overclocked workstation.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
I just built a workstation using the AMD Phenom II 1100T that competes with lower end i7s and high end overclocked Core2 Intel CPUs for around $1,100. Of course if you want bleeding edge performance wait a bit for the Ivy-Bridge cores to come out from Intel.
There is another point to be learned from the Punch Holder benchmark. That benchmark ran in about 300 seconds on my old machine. By correcting some modeling errors and using different modeling techniques I was able to get it to rebuild in around 20 seconds. The moral of this is that using your head is worth more than a $4,000 overclocked workstation.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
- Thread starter
- #7
cinnamongirl
Mechanical
So I'm getting the impression that there are workstation graphics cards (Quadro, FireGL), there are workstation-caliber processors (Xeon, Opteron), but there is no such thing as a workstation specific motherboard.
Xeon is not a workstation calibre processor. It is a server calibre processor that gets used in a lot of workstations because it has a cool name. There is no evidence that the extra money returns something in performance with SolidWorks. Did you look at the bench mark site I mentioned or the Architecture link? You want to be talking about core architecture, not marketing names. Right now Ivy-Bridge core is what you want.
There are non-workstation grade motherboards. Just go buy a cheapo PC and find out. Boxx uses off the shelf motherboards that are from known reputable manufacturers and have the chipsets and IO necessary for workstation use.
If you want to find something good and solid look at a website like Anandtech.com and look at what they use for benchmarking. Likewise you can look at the solidmuse.com and see what the user community is using.
For my 2 cents I use Asus and wouldn't have qualms about Gigabyte or some others.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
There are non-workstation grade motherboards. Just go buy a cheapo PC and find out. Boxx uses off the shelf motherboards that are from known reputable manufacturers and have the chipsets and IO necessary for workstation use.
If you want to find something good and solid look at a website like Anandtech.com and look at what they use for benchmarking. Likewise you can look at the solidmuse.com and see what the user community is using.
For my 2 cents I use Asus and wouldn't have qualms about Gigabyte or some others.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
Workstation motherboards are the same as server motherboards.
The difference is not necessarily in computing power but in dependability and longer life (hours used).
My experience is that it is not necessary, a quality gaming board is just as good.
-Joe
SolidWorks 2009 x64 SP 5.1 on Windows XP x64
8 GB RAM - Nvidia Quadro FX1700
The difference is not necessarily in computing power but in dependability and longer life (hours used).
My experience is that it is not necessary, a quality gaming board is just as good.
-Joe
SolidWorks 2009 x64 SP 5.1 on Windows XP x64
8 GB RAM - Nvidia Quadro FX1700
Actually the diffences will be in the chipsets used and the type and amount of memory. Server boards will also have facilities for network management. My servers have such things as well as the ability to hot swap hard drives and dual redundant power supplies, fans and other things. Server boards will also not have sockets for much of a graphics card as they typically don't do graphics. Many times the graphics, if it is there, will be a simple rudimentary graphics chip on the board.
The real questions that should be asked in setting up a system is how fast will it run SolidWorks. That is hard to judge on paper. That is where looking at hundreds of systems can be a big help. If you did have to look at what runs SolidWorks fast I would say a gaming system is going to be a lot closer that a server.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
The real questions that should be asked in setting up a system is how fast will it run SolidWorks. That is hard to judge on paper. That is where looking at hundreds of systems can be a big help. If you did have to look at what runs SolidWorks fast I would say a gaming system is going to be a lot closer that a server.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
- Thread starter
- #11
cinnamongirl
Mechanical
Intel has a category for "Workstation Boards", very limited selection though, and it still doesn't explain what's different from a desktop motherboard. Two of them support dual processors, and one of them has 12 memory sockets!
to me a here are my definitions for "computers"
gaming rig:
-fast single core cpu
-SSD
-non-ECC ram up to 8GB
-2x dual GPU gamming graphics card with around 4GB ram
work station: for simulation purposes
-dual socket mainboard for future expension
-uses ECC ram with approx. 24GB ram when both sockets are populated
-raid-0 SAS drives (no SSD because you will have no clue when those high speed NAND flash ram will die on you, but i know some still perfer SSD, so it's your choice)
-work station graphics cards (or SLI,CxFire for programs like 3DS)
server setup:
- RAID-5 setup
- atleast dual socket or multi-socket boards
-only uses windows server or simliar class
- redundent power supply
- 12+ GB ram
-built-in graphics
- dual lan port for workload balancing
gaming rig:
-fast single core cpu
-SSD
-non-ECC ram up to 8GB
-2x dual GPU gamming graphics card with around 4GB ram
work station: for simulation purposes
-dual socket mainboard for future expension
-uses ECC ram with approx. 24GB ram when both sockets are populated
-raid-0 SAS drives (no SSD because you will have no clue when those high speed NAND flash ram will die on you, but i know some still perfer SSD, so it's your choice)
-work station graphics cards (or SLI,CxFire for programs like 3DS)
server setup:
- RAID-5 setup
- atleast dual socket or multi-socket boards
-only uses windows server or simliar class
- redundent power supply
- 12+ GB ram
-built-in graphics
- dual lan port for workload balancing
Here are some motherboards marketed as workstation:
ASUS P5E64 WS Professional
ASUS P6T7 WS SuperComputer
ASUS P6T6 WS Revolution
GigaByte GA-6TXSL
There is a major difference between server and workstation configurations. The trend today is to run server software in virtual machines so multi socket multicore setups with lots of RAM are necessary. On the other hand, the trend with servers is to have no storage or graphics card capability on the motherboard. They don't even boot from their own disk many times. Lower end servers may have local disk and graphics capability.
Workstations will typically have a single socket, room for 12GB or more of RAM and multiple graphics card sockets as well as RAID capable disk controllers. They will typically run the OS directly on the CPU. Depending on the software a workstation will utilize one or more cores. In the case of SolidWorks, about 2 cores are all that are needed, although running PhotoWorks or PhotoView 360 will utilize all the cores you have.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
ASUS P5E64 WS Professional
ASUS P6T7 WS SuperComputer
ASUS P6T6 WS Revolution
GigaByte GA-6TXSL
There is a major difference between server and workstation configurations. The trend today is to run server software in virtual machines so multi socket multicore setups with lots of RAM are necessary. On the other hand, the trend with servers is to have no storage or graphics card capability on the motherboard. They don't even boot from their own disk many times. Lower end servers may have local disk and graphics capability.
Workstations will typically have a single socket, room for 12GB or more of RAM and multiple graphics card sockets as well as RAID capable disk controllers. They will typically run the OS directly on the CPU. Depending on the software a workstation will utilize one or more cores. In the case of SolidWorks, about 2 cores are all that are needed, although running PhotoWorks or PhotoView 360 will utilize all the cores you have.
TOP
CSWP, BSSE
"Node news is good news."
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