This is why you need good drawings (or contractor w/ common sense) 13

[COEngineeer]

The photo and the plan explains it all. Enjoy

 

[CJJS]

I agree with jmiec. Looks like the contractor is trying to make a point, although I don't think the drawing is that confusing. I would assume that there was a section through the stairs that would clarify the number of risers.

 

[apsix]

Call me a sceptic but I don't yet believe it hasn't been photoshopped.

 

[BigInch]

The photo has definitely not been tampered with. Did you mean the drawing?

BigInch-born in the trenches.

http://virtualpipeline.spaces.msn.com

 

[bylar]

I had a similar situation. On my typical section of the footing I had a tag with a solid circle at the end with the note "32"x12" ftg with 4-#4 bars continous" the tags circle was at the high side of the footing. The builder placed the 4 bars of reinforcing steel at 3" off the ground. The building inspector made him move one bar to the top of the footing where the tag circle was shown.
Even after I pointed out his mistake, the inspector required the bar at the top.

 

[BigInch]

Just goes to show that the old saying, "Be careful what you wish for, you might get it.", applies to drawings.

BigInch-born in the trenches.

http://virtualpipeline.spaces.msn.com

 

[dozer]

The only point that the contractor made is that he is an idiot. Yes, the drawing is not that great. Okay, it's even bad but if the contractor thought you wanted this, why didn't he asked what the dimensions are supposed to be? Did he scale it? One of the first things I was taught after I came out of my mother's womb is never scale a drawing. Now I see why.

As for the comment about there is no arrow. I rarely see arrows on this kind of detail symbol.

I've beat up the contractor, now let's talk about the drafter for a second. I get sick and tired of trying to explain to drafters how stupid people can be and why you have to bend over backwards to make drawings clear. I work with a guy who has been doing this for 30 years and he still doesn't get it.

 

[zestructural]

Dozer,

The longer the drafter is in the business the less he/she is willing to change.

 

[BSE05]

The topic of drafters has come up in this thread.

Are there many drafters employeed out there? When I started in this business there were 2 "draftsmen" for every engineer. With the use of CAD over the last 10 years the drafter, at least in the NE USA, has gone the way of the dinosaur. Engineers seem to be doing alot of their work on CAD themselves.

I was told that back in the 50-60's it was expected that an engineer spend a couple of years on the "boards" before they were allowed to design. This had changed when I started in the 70's.

What is the experience of this forum with present day drafters? How many engineers do their own or partial CAD?

 

[StructuralEd]

Isn't it funny how the most idiotic items are the ones that are never queried before proceeding?

Maybe a note on the drawings is in order:
"Call BEFORE making any decisions."

 

[BigInch]

The standards for and how to produce drawings have been developed over a couple of hundred years now, and if used properly, result in unambiguous concepts suitable for construction without making any phone calls. In those few situations that can still remain ambiguous regardless of the number of views included, the use of explicatory notes to clarify the idea is in order.

What is amazing to me today are the immense numbers of "draftsmen" that cannot even arrange plan, profile and elevation views in the proper locations on a piece of drawing paper, never mind pay attention to line weights. When you eventually find one that can, treat them with all the respect they deserve.... nothing short of what you would give Michealangelo Buonarroti.

BigInch-born in the trenches.

http://virtualpipeline.spaces.msn.com

 

[hokie66]

The draftsmen who are left are the ones who had to be careful about making mistakes on manually prepared drawings. A few times repeating their work on linen or mylar taught them to think. Drawings now are prepared largely by computer operators (including some engineers), and the drawings look very neat, but often are gibberish.

 

[SrGilberto]

How do you post a picture?

SrG.

 

[Dinosaur]

Like many of you folks, I've been fighting this sort of thing my whole career. One fellow summed it all up in a nice quip, "Don't bother making the drawings idiot proof. They'll always come up with a better idiot."

Thanks for the post.

 

[jrfroe]

Funny picture... I showed this to an architect in our office, and he said he had something similar happen when his column line labels all fell onto the center of a sidewalk just outside the building. Every 20' the contractor ended up forming a circle which was raised 2" above the sidewalk (no numbers or letters though).

Its scary to think of all the unintended information that can be extrapolated out of a set of plans. Where the contractor should be asking questions like "what are the dimensions of this funky cutout in the stair?" or "what are these circles in the sidewalk and how high should they protrude above the surface?" they just forge ahead with incorrect assumptions.

I've noticed that the "good" contractors, engineers, drafters, etc. are the ones that ask lots of questions. Agree?

 

[telecomguy]

I received a similar photo, but subtly different...

http://img104.imageshack.us/img104/3273/84349996gq7.jpg

<tg>

 

[COEngineeer]

hahahah... ok. .that one is photoshopped for sure.

 

[JStephen]

Which brings us back to the question of whether the original photo is for real or not.

 

[Ussuri]

Similar sort of thing, a revision cloud.

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"The world keeps turning, it keeps me in my place; where I stand is only three miles from space"
Spiritualized

 

[broekie]

More nice work with Photoshop.

 

[KCRatnayake]

Hi,
I am practising in Sri Lanka. I have seen this revision cloud like opening one occation. You get this profile when making openings in concrete slabs / walls with diamond coring rigs.

Clefcon