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Texas power issues. Wind farms getting iced up (Part II)... 38
- Thread starter JohnRBaker
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At 15F humans dont become hypothermic without severe outside influences like mass consumption of alcohol or drugs, immersion in water, or being extremely elderly/frail. Like all mammals, the human body generates a lot of heat. Trap a minimal amount of it and you will survive without damage.
Homes stateside have been required to have functional CO detectors for decades. Products producing CO have been required to have a large number of warnings in both the operating instructions and on the product for decades. I seriously doubt most of the homes affected dropped below 50F during this incident, uncomfortable to some but hardly life-threatening.
JMO but this has become another political/media-fueled illogical witch hunt. Hanlon's razor - never attribute to malice that best explained by stupidity.
Less unfounded opinions would be great.
may also include low blood sugar, anorexia, and advanced age
In the UK, 28,354 cases of hypothermia were treated in 2012–13 – an increase of 25% from the previous year.[35] Some cases of hypothermia death, as well as other preventable deaths, happen because poor people cannot easily afford to keep warm. Rising fuel bills have increased the numbers who have difficulty paying for adequate heating in the UK. Some pensioners and disabled people are at risk because they do not work and cannot easily leave their homes.[clarification needed] Better heat insulation can help.[36][37][38]
may also include low blood sugar, anorexia, and advanced age
In the UK, 28,354 cases of hypothermia were treated in 2012–13 – an increase of 25% from the previous year.[35] Some cases of hypothermia death, as well as other preventable deaths, happen because poor people cannot easily afford to keep warm. Rising fuel bills have increased the numbers who have difficulty paying for adequate heating in the UK. Some pensioners and disabled people are at risk because they do not work and cannot easily leave their homes.[clarification needed] Better heat insulation can help.[36][37][38]
@1503-44: In excess of 100 fatalities is still a whole bunch more than should be tolerated... whatever the reason/excuse... like a 3rd world country!
Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?
-Dik
Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?
-Dik
Agree. I dont think I implied otherwise. I was contending CWB1's implication that death by hypothermia was fake news or was only possible for "massive drug addicts", febel elders and alcoholics, which suggests that it is perfectly OK for us to totally ignore the facts as reported, or justify their death as some kind of personally inflicted suicide, without a shread of evidence.
Ditto. Take care to stay that way. Coincidently, my power went off for 4h last night, but it was 18°C, so not being a massive drug addict and I only had one scotch, it was ... Just dark. Lit some candles and all was well, until the lights woke me up at 2am and the neighbours dogs started barking. ![[puppy]](/data/assets/smilies/puppy.gif "[puppy] [puppy]")
Sorry if commonly known scientific facts disagree with your point, but yes - without extreme outside influencers like those mentioned it is literally impossible for a human to become hypothermic at 15F. IOW, blaming the lack of power for hypothermic deaths is indeed a stretch and at this point an extremely dishonest one. But please, continue to misconstrue my posts.
Alistair_Heaton
Mechanical
The old folk start dropping dead when the temp goes below -3 in Scotland with a huge step increase.
From mil experience I sort agree that most adults should be able to survive it with suitable clothing and no other adverse conditions eg they got there clothes wet.
Although that said I find dealing with -20 in the baltics much easier to deal with than 0 degs in Scotland. Humidity and wind play a huge part. We did have a few go down with it on army exercises but they tended to be the marathon runners. In fact the medic that used to dish out the most abuse to us fatties was usually the first to get pulled into the meat wagon. He was running the London marathon finishing in double digit placement.
From mil experience I sort agree that most adults should be able to survive it with suitable clothing and no other adverse conditions eg they got there clothes wet.
Although that said I find dealing with -20 in the baltics much easier to deal with than 0 degs in Scotland. Humidity and wind play a huge part. We did have a few go down with it on army exercises but they tended to be the marathon runners. In fact the medic that used to dish out the most abuse to us fatties was usually the first to get pulled into the meat wagon. He was running the London marathon finishing in double digit placement.
I had an architect buddy that thought that -5C in Toronto was colder than -40C in the west...because it's a damp cold. He realised the error of his ways when exposed to real -40C in Regina... -40C is a lot colder anywhere, than 0C in Scotland... and as far as the drug addicts, alcoholics, old codgers, etc... they're still people that sufferend. There was also an 84 year old woman and a 7 year old child... not likely addicts...
Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?
-Dik
Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?
-Dik
Alistair_Heaton
Mechanical
I agree -40 is a different ball game.
Windchill plays a huge part as well.
It tends to be Siberian high calm wind when it's that cold here.
The availability and possession of suitable clothing is also a factor. We just have them in the house and come Dec the kids are automatically putting there balaclava on and snowsuits.
I am sure you also get a mind set dealing with it if it happens every year. Texans I doubt have the automatic habits for dealing with cold or protecting their kids.
We used to stick our kid out in his pram to sleep at lunchtime in -15. It's deemed normal. If you did that in Scotland the kid would be taken into care.
Windchill plays a huge part as well.
It tends to be Siberian high calm wind when it's that cold here.
The availability and possession of suitable clothing is also a factor. We just have them in the house and come Dec the kids are automatically putting there balaclava on and snowsuits.
I am sure you also get a mind set dealing with it if it happens every year. Texans I doubt have the automatic habits for dealing with cold or protecting their kids.
We used to stick our kid out in his pram to sleep at lunchtime in -15. It's deemed normal. If you did that in Scotland the kid would be taken into care.
CWB1 said:
But you forgot this.
Hypothermia can also occur in connection with malnutrition, fatigue, brain damage, and in impaired ability to produce hormone from the thyroid gland or adrenal glands.
Older people and small children are more sensitive as they have less compensation opportunities and are therefore more easily exposed to hypothermia.
Normally in this situations you are outside and can go inside where it is warm.
If you are inside and its already 15F, -10 C and you do not have any means to heat yourself, except your own energi depot, it is different.
Greater risk of frostbite
A limited reinstatement of flow to the extremities leads to greater risk of frostbite, but reduces the risk of cooling down, and vice versa.
The body’s main defence against cooling down is shivering, and how effectively we shiver is also individual.
Some of the research subjects who bathe in the 15-degree water shiver violently.
This causes the muscles to release energy, providing warmth and keeping the body temperature up.
But others do not shiver at all and are unprotected against the cold.
Their body temperature falls quickly. After 20–25 minutes, it can be as low as 35 degrees.
Violent – or effective – shiverers can remain in the 15-degree water for longer, some of them for more than an hour and a half, while fundamentally maintaining their body temperature.
Best Regards A
“Logic will get you from A to Z; imagination will get you everywhere.“
Albert Einstein
CWB1 "misconstrue my posts"
I quoted you directly.
CWB1 "Commonly understood facts"
Perhaps, in which case you should have no difficulty proving "Commonly understood facts".
You have not disproven the 10 deaths in Harris County due to hypothermia, except by saying "Commonly understood facts" makes that impossible.
Let's just say you presented your best argument and now ... we can put a pin in that topic.
I quoted you directly.
CWB1 "Commonly understood facts"
Perhaps, in which case you should have no difficulty proving "Commonly understood facts".
You have not disproven the 10 deaths in Harris County due to hypothermia, except by saying "Commonly understood facts" makes that impossible.
Let's just say you presented your best argument and now ... we can put a pin in that topic.
Alistair_Heaton
Mechanical
What's happening these days in regards to companies going bust and them trying to dig themselves out of a hole?
There were reports of carbon monoxide deaths in Texas from people running there cars with the door closed. And I don't believe that most cars have warning labels about this (well maybe in the owners manual, which no one reads, except maybe engineers and lawyers).
But that should have been common since to not do that. Pity the lack of education.
But that should have been common since to not do that. Pity the lack of education.
Alistair_Heaton
Mechanical
The one that used to do for people in the UK was old paraffin/kerosene heaters that lived in the garages and never touched for years.
People didn't know that you had to run them outside until they got up to temp and wick right length before taking them inside.
Most just lighted them inside and didn't know a sooty orange flame was looking death in the eye.
People didn't know that you had to run them outside until they got up to temp and wick right length before taking them inside.
Most just lighted them inside and didn't know a sooty orange flame was looking death in the eye.
A lot of the carbon monoxide cases were caused by people bringing fuel heating into the residence... not all carbon monoxide from vehicles... it also appears the education system is failing, too.
Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?
-Dik
Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?
-Dik
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