Tek-Tips is the largest IT community on the Internet today!

Members share and learn making Tek-Tips Forums the best source of peer-reviewed technical information on the Internet!

  • Congratulations LittleInch on being selected by the Eng-Tips community for having the most helpful posts in the forums last week. Way to Go!

Teaching Load Paths Used in Structural Engineering Discussion

Ron247

Structural
Joined
Jan 18, 2019
Messages
1,425
Location
US
Note: this thread may start and stop periodically as I see people’s comments and then see if I have other needs for input.

From a prior thread, the topic of Load Paths (LP) came up. I tried to recall when I first heard of them and started practicing tracing them. I arrived at the BS degree level did not teach them and none of my BS level textbooks even have a reference to them. I do recall hearing of them while taking my Master’s. I looked online and found some instructional videos and watched 2 or 3. One was an hour long from a university lecture. The structures in that video were more complex than you get in a BS degree so I assume it was a Grad level course. One was a skyscraper with floors that cantilevered back to a “central” core for stability. Big, but not complicated in terms of load paths. The other 2 videos had very simple and symmetric structures they traced. Since I feel LPs are important for students to understand early in their training, it started me thinkng about them.

I tried to think of how I would explain LPs to a Junior level BS student. I arrived at the basic definition of a LP that I use is somewhat common for experienced engineers, but it can be confusing to students. I intend to keep using it in the future, but not when explaining to novices on the subject.

For both experienced engineers and students, I am interested in what your definition of load paths is and when you recall first hearing of them. I am also curious what answers you get to the following 2 Free-Body Diagrams if you applied your definition to the task. While these 2 are simple for experienced engineers, they are more complex than the examples used in the videos I watched.

The first is a Simple Span Beam.

The second is a Bridge Bracket used on new bridge construction to form and pour the outer overhang such as gutter and guardrail areas. Note that I do not think reaction Rc is truly present and definitely not present on downward arm loads. The bracket has a single point load called P6. Trace the paths based on the letters shown at the joints and load application. Points B and E are the only 2 places where the bracket either mechanically attaches (B) or bears against (E) the bridge girder.

1752856082921.png



1752856103142.jpeg
 
so you could generalise this, once the students know your terminology ... here are a set of load forces, and here are the equivalent set of reactions ... that "equivalent" is an important concept. loadpaths link each load to each reaction (generally) ... you can show the "two force member" concept ... load and reaction are on the same line of action.

what education level are you teaching ? HS, college, uni ??
 
I am not teaching any level. I have briefly taught at a college when they got short-handed for a semester or 2. I run into students and recent grads periodically that ask me questions. I know people whose kids are in college, and sometimes one of their friends in engineering gets stumped. I like learning to describe things in a way they grasp concepts mentally before getting into calcs. I feel we jump to calcs way too quickly.

Also, as I get older, I do more refereeing, consulting or expert testimony. In legal, that is 13 or 1 matters, 12 jurors+1 judge, or just 1 judge. In refereeing, it is 2. Your Client and their opposition. If you can get the opposition to understand you better than they can understand their own engineer, your Client tends to fair better. I have had the other engineer explain a simple situation in a complicated fashion. I see their own client and mine confused. I then explain what he said back to my client, and I see the other guy's client nodding his head up and down in approval. So, at that point, don't blow it, your client is doing good.

In the last 10 years I have started emphasizing this concept more but I actually was exposed to it about 45 years ago. Only much later in my life did I realize the value in it but did not absorb at the time. I really struggled with electricity in physics. The day before a big test on something electrical, I was totally lost, could not grasp anything. Pretty much panicking. A friend's father was an Electrical Engineer that apparently did a ton or work in court cases. Power companies loved to hire him. Juries understood what he described. He met with me for about 75 minutes. I think we reviewed 3 chapters. He asked me about how quickly did class jump into calcs and heavy math. He told me that was a bad place to start learning. He started with something like your wheelbarrow scenario. He explained electricity like water hoses in a sense along with something about avoiding resistance. I left able to work all the problems without issue. I knew what to look for first, then how to organize. Did not study any more for the test. Shot pool and had a few adult beverages instead that night. Made a 97 on the test. Then I got stupid very quickly. I did not absorb the methodology he used to teach me. Instead, I remembered the way to solve those stupid problems, I would never need again. Within 6 months of getting out of physics, I could not remember what the electrical topic even was let alone with how to solve one.
 
Interesting. I completely agree about learning specific cases ... learn the general case, then you can solve any problem. Being able to get your ideas across to the audience d'jour is so super important. Have you seen any of the YT videos "I'm an expert" ... got to watch them ... like Dilbert, every one is so applicable to (at least) my work experience. I particularly liked when talking about red lines, the customer wanted them drawn with green ink; so the expert says "you can't", the PM jumps on him, and he explains wrapping up with "well, not everybody would notice the difference, some people a red/green colour blind, but I'm sure (he adds with a chuckle) that they are not your target audience." and this confuses the customer and gives them the rope "so, not everyone ...".
 
Oh yeah, I think IRStuff has a link to that one that I clicked on. I really enjoyed it. I did not know there were others. Gives me something to do for entertainment. I have actually been in a company meeting years ago when the PM showed us a rendering of the building we were going to do for a large Japanese firm. It was an in-house meeting of just employees. The salesman went crazy when he saw the building was green. Started chewing people out who did not have to answer to him. Screaming and pressing both hands to his temple while he shouted at us. It would have been humorous to record. This was years ago when a rendering was an actual painting.

Apparently, years prior to that he had a rendering of green building shown to a client that really hated green. Client got mad and went elsewhere. So his takeaway was NO MORE GREEN BUILDINGS. PERIOD. I asked him why not just ask the Client if there were any colors they preferred or that they really did not want. He thought that was not a solution better than no green buildings.
 
. learn the general case, then you can solve any problem.

That is the best way to learn for me. Get a feeling of what is going on first, learn the concepts, terminology, and steps to a final answer. Then you can solve any of the problems by applying that with some sound thinking. The students trying to learn by memorizing example problems may be setting the stage for overall failure. They must memorize thousands of example problems with a mental catalogue system that provides for retrieval. Won't happen. While it may be a good short-term system to get a passing grade in a class, it is not a good long-term one. You do not tend to forget what you absorb, but you can easily forget what you learn.
 
I had to color load paths/vectors on all FBDs starting in first-semester Statics, red for compression paths and blue for tension. One of the first examples I remember are linkage clevis/yokes, the question was why the "legs" can be so long without material in-between (ala the green block in the attached pic).
I agree that its a critical concept to understand, especially when you're trying to minimize material/weight like ribbed castings.
Screen Shot 2025-07-21 at 7.29.51 PM.png
image.jpeg
 
Last edited:
Was the vacant area with the green present so the threaded rod could extend into the location due to adjustment?
 

Part and Inventory Search

Sponsor

Back
Top