signature in drawings 1

[macPT]

We are triyng to put the signatures in the drawings, so it can be visible (opening the drawing) who designed and who approved it.

We have produced tiff files of the signatures, but these images, inserted in the drawings, cover some area of the drawing template causing a poor visual result.

We have vectorized the tiff files and created SW symbols. The visual aspect is excelent, but the file as more 300k of information (which is a lot).

Is there any other ideas?

Thanks

 

[DetroitPickles]

MacPT,

I wonder if a GIF will work? I believe you can make a GIF that contains a transparent background, but you have to have photo software. I don't believe TIF's or JPG's can do this. With a transparent background (used on the web a lot), the stuff behind the images "background" can still be seen. So, maybe it would work in a SW Title Block.

Unless someone else does, or has a different idea, I will look tonight when I get home and let you know.

I'll repost either way...

Mr. Pickles

 

[SBaugh]

I use Paint shop pro. You can see some of the work at my site. Where my name is at on my site. That used to say "YOUR LOGO". I used a combination of Excel, the Clipboard (print screen), and paint shop pro. I made my name with no background using layers in PSP. Then transposed the background and the name to make one image file. Then placed the image into Dreamweaver.

This would probably work the same way in SW as it did for me in PSP, but you will need to understand image software to make it work in your favor.

Just a thought for you to ponder.

Best Regards, Scott Baugh, CSWP
3DVision Technologies

http://www.3dvisiontech.com

http://www.3dmca.com

faq731-376
When in doubt, always check the help

 

[HWard]

Hi there...

I was wondering if you had considered a broader solution to just posting a signature of approval and design on the actual document. Standard Doc. Mgt procedures are actually one of the cheaper things to automate these days and you can keep track of who designed/approved specs last, tracking for quality and pedigree... as well as making it easier to track previously designed parts, and even dumping it into BOM's, unless you like re-typing the same info into various systems....

Please let me know if these are issues you are trying to resolve and I'll be happy to help if I can.

Thanks!

 

[drawoh]

macPT,

What is the difference between typing in the signature and applying a GIF, JPEG or TIF file? Regardless of which of these solutions you implement, there is nothing to stop me from applying your signature to a drawing I want checked or approved.

Are you trying keep track of who approves stuff, or are you just trying to pretty up your drawings?

JHG

 

[JNR]

I guess I agree with optech but I will be a bit more blunt.

WHY?

Besides saying good luck reading 50% of the "signatures" out there, it is a total waste of time because it does not give you any value added - merely a (very) false sense of security. It's no better than having a rubber stamp make of your signature. There are much better digtal methods for signing documents (ie: electronic files) and some of them are quite inexpensive stand-alones. If you want to visually see who signed it - type it in. I can only logically view copied signatures as emotional security blankies. If someone is trying to push you into this, explain these things to them (more politely than me, granted) and that you are trying to move away from drawing boards and into the digital world. You can also tell them how much more real productive work you could get done if you weren't dinking around with TIFF files and stuff.

And here is an interesting little paradox. You finish the drawing. You put it out for approval and release. At that point you should not be changing the FILE in any way - it should be protected. Now you want to come back and make a change (add signatures!). How can you prove (say to an IOS 9000 or AS9100 auditor) that someone did not slip in a little "correction" here and there at the same time?

Granted we have a PDM system (SmarTeam), but we only enter signature data by typing in it AT THE NEXT TIME A REVISION IS DONE. So the sign-off information on the electronic file is always historical. However, since we have not yet implemented (soon!!!) the electronic sign-off (SmartFlow), we do maintain a hardcopy with real signatures for proof. I'm not saying it's perfect, but it does work, and if the FAA says it's OK, it should satisfy pretty much anyone.

Hope this helps.

 

[DetroitPickles]

macPT,

I see there has been some people wondering what you were doing this for. I had the same questions, but I tried to give you a solution. What Scott and I wrote before is true. What Scott is talking about (if I read it right) will not work in Solidworks. He created an image with a transparent (no) background. I can't get a GIF or PNT file (both have transparent background) into solidworks. Apparently, SW doesn't know what to do with a GIF, so it just shows a box with the file name in it.

Unless there is another idea out there...

Mr. Pickles

 

[macPT]

Thanks for your posts.

DetroitPickles
I was triyng to use your idea of a transparent background GIF file, with no luck. Apparently you have alredy get to the conclusion taht I suspected: SW doesn't understand other GIF files.

All of you wonder why I whant to do that. Good question. It's not a document tracking or quality assurance problem. We have other methods to ensure the only the latest approved revisions of the drawing are available to third parties, with the adequate file protections (like JNR we maintain a hardcopy with real signatures for proof, we have a global management software with the actual data of the drawings, the approved files are accesible to everyone but write protected).

The problem is the following: we have supliers for many components we design. This will grow in the future. The tendency is that we will be a company with the design, the know-how, the final assembly and the erection/selling. All the components manufacture (injection moulding, machinning, stamping,...) will be done by third parties, according to our specifications.

The distribution of drawings to third parties is growing in a manner that it will not take to long to change the name from Design and Development Dep. to Copy Center Dep.. I need to change this.

The great majority of our supliers doesn't have CAD systems. The best we can get are supliers with AUTOCAD. No PDM or document management will work in this case. But almost all have an e-mail.

So what I am considering (I have done already some successful tests) in e-mail pdf's of the drawings, instead of fotocopies of the signed hardcopies. This will not change (I mean for worse) the actual procedures of document control of the company. But the supliers will receive documents with no signature and, for them, this can be puzzling. I want to reproduce the signatures (in the hardcopies)in these pdf files. Like some of you referred, it will be just a cosmetic issue, with low value added. But this method will not steal so much time to do what we should be doing: design. Of course the access to the slddrw files for signature insertion and for pdf creation will be restricted to some few authorized personnel.

Was I clear enough?
Please post your comments.

Regards

 

[EdDanzer]

I use Brush Script MT italic font for names of the people involved in the drawing, it looks like hand written, and is easy to read.

 

[DetroitPickles]

That is the font I used when trying the transparent GIF thing. Using this font on the drawing is better than straight text, if you have the font.
Mr. Pickles

 

[StarrRider]

I will never forget the VP of Engineering in a company that I used to work for. He was trying to impress people how savvy he was and included a GIF file in the P.O.s (Excel) that he wrote.
Then I took over the task of writing the P.O.s for the entire department and gave them to him. He notice the first time he tried to sign one of them that his GIF Signature was already there. He gave me this really questioning look, but didn’t say a word. It saved me a lot of time, especially when he wasn't there.
Of course, if he had REALLY looked at it he would have noticed the difference. His original GIF was a scanned in image that had been cropped and reduced many times and didn’t look all that great. I did edit it for legibility, but I don’t think he ever noticed that.

Lee

 

[drawoh]

macPT,

The advantage of plotting your drawings on vellum, signing the plots and making blueprints of them, is that you can verify the source of any drawings people are working with. I like blue/white print machines because you can only print from the vellum original, and you cannot modify the blueprint. Xeroxes are evil.

You want to issue drawings to vendors in a portable format, and you do not want them modified. You want to be able to visit your vendors and verify that they are working with your approved, unmodified drawings.

Am I right?

Solutions:

1.] Issue blueprints as noted above. This does not stop you from issuing DWG/DXFs, but these are unofficial. The blueprint is official and always correct, regardless of what is on the DWG/DXF file.

2.] Write your files out as PDF. To an engineering/manufacturing shop, this is a read-only format, although I would not trust graphics shops. It will probably be difficult to get large prints off of the PDF, and there will be no way to extract part geometry off of it.

3.] Write your files out as DWG/DXF and record the exact size (to the byte) of the file, and the date. It will be hard for your vendor to modify the file without changing the size and date. It will be harder if you issue in DXF rather than DWG.

4.] Attach a digital checksum to your files. There must be technology for this. If somebody modifies something, the checksum changes. This is a more reliable check than just recording the file size and date

Consider what happens when you visit your vendor and see that someone has plotted a copy of your electronic file. How do you verify that the file is an exact copy of what you sent? I can load a read-only file, change a dimension and then print. All I cannot do is save.

Consider how you apply limit tolerances to your scale CAD models. Eg. 16.15/16.05DIA. I draw my parts to exact nominal size, in this case, 16mm, and set the tolerances to +0.15.+0.05. Another designer might arbitrarily use MMC, setting the lower limits for his holes and the upper limits for his shafts. In this case, the model would be 16.05mm, and the tolerances would be +0.10/0. Modeling the hole and shaft at LMC is a dumb idea, that will not stop everyone from doing it. Another approach is to model at 16.10mm, and set the tolerances to +/-0.05. How to you interpret a dimension like 23.72/23.61DIA from the model?

What this all shows us is that model dimensions do not provide a reliable description of dimensions with accurate tolerances. Those blueprints look better and better to me.

JHG

 

[StarrRider]

macPT

Did anybody try inserting the GIF into an Excel spreadsheet that was inserted in the drawing? All of my drawing templates contain an Excel template for the ECO data. I knew that Excel does know how to handle GIF files correctly so I tried it in there. I had to create a GIF signature to do it. I didn’t try printing it but it looked great to me

Lee

Your just jealous because the voices only talk to me.