Request for supplier documentation

[AusSteelMan]

I have recently been allocated to a large project that basically is going to build a new steelworks based Steam generation and Power Plant. My background is Mechanical Asset Strategist for a Strip Casting Project, Oxy Plant, Gasholders and Gas Distribution. The installed plant (when operating) will be part of the Energy Dept i am/was working for.

The task I have been asked to kick off, is part of a documentation specification. That is, when we buy items, what type of information do we want the vendors to supply, what electronic format, timing etc.

I have started to make a list of What, When, How etc, partially based on when I have worked on old equipment in the middle of the night and could not readily find the information required.

I won't bore you with the list, but I am wondering if anyone else has written a similar type of document, or more likely, what lack of original calcs, part info etc have you been caught out on, so I may consider.

I have not really found a better forim to post this in, but please feel free to let me know.

Many thanks,
ASM

 

[tomwalz]

I would contact potential vendors and ask them for information. Then I would pick the format I liked best. I would take all the specifications offered from different sources and make a list of all of them. In my experience different vendors will offer different kinds of information.

E.G Vendor A sends a fax, vendor B sends a book and vendor C sends an email see which is handiest to use. I like non-secure PDF’s for negotiation so that I can make changes and send them back. Secure PDF’s when it is finalized.

If company A says our unit does A,B,C,D,
Company B says our unit does A,C,F,G
Then put a list together and ask for specs on A,B,C,D,E,F,G


Thomas J. Walz
Carbide Processors, Inc.

http://www.carbideprocessors.com

 

[dvd]

I don't much care for the concept of making vendors jump through unknown hoops. You need to think about what information and format is useful to you and make your requests based on that. By "you" I mean your organization. Don't get stuck in a position where everyone is looking to you to make all the decisions, if other parties are going to need information then they need to tell you what it is. Don't ask for something that you don't need and don't make people (they are people) do un-necessary work because you don't know what you want.

 

[monkeydog]

If you (your company) have a particular format you want/need, then ask for that format. Let your supplier provide the info you ask for in his format, it will be easier and quicker for him to get that info to you. Ask for what you want/need. Any other data will cost you time and money.

 

[tomwalz]

The problem is that most purchasers don’t know as much as most vendors do about what the vendor supplies. My firm sells advanced materials. Commonly we get RFQs asking for bids based on a classification system sixty years old. When we try to offer suggestions we are told to just follow the format and bid on what is requested.

We try to stay somewhere near proven state of the art. As an example, I just bought a little flat screen TV for the den. I went to several stores and talked to salespeople. I paid about $20 more than I had to for the same size but I know what I got and why the extra $20 was a good deal.

If I hadn’t talked to different vendors and had just gone on size and price I wouldn’t have gotten as good a deal.

In my experience most vendors are happy to work with legitimate prospects.


Thomas J. Walz
Carbide Processors, Inc.

http://www.carbideprocessors.com

 

[AusSteelMan]

Thankyou all so far. I have got many of the same deep seeded hesitations that you seem to be expressing. To make matters worse (or maybe better?), I have since found a company document that describes most of what I've been asked to write up. I really now have to find out what they are asking for, because I don't think they really know. The majority of my history is in Maint and Eng, not document storage etc, so I really only know what I have not had on hand in the past. Of course these are specifics, whereas this task is asking generally.
I agree with you secong post tomwalz, the vendors know their product a heck of a lot more than I do. I am also aware of "don't ask, don't get" as a basic philosophy, especially when it costs people thier time and effort to provide.

Thanks everyone again.
ASM

 

[KENAT]

Probably not applicable to you but just in case.

If you are taking CAD data, especially 3D, from vendors you may want to specify what format you want it in.

While there are a number of ways around this I'd be wary of just accepting step or iges files, for assemblies especially.

Ideally you'd want the data in whatever format your CAD system is, doesn't mean they have to create the stuff in your CAD system but they need to have it converted before giving it to you and verify it translated properly. There are companies that do this.

Method of data transfer may also be significant, email, ftp, secure ftp, burned CD...


We are getting major sub systems of our new tool designed externally and models submitted to us. We didn't specify what model format in the contract so we have to take step/iges and spend lots of time translating them & making them work.

Also on some of them we own the drawings but didn't give any requirements of what standard the drawings were to be to, eg ASME Y14.5M-1994 or equivalent.

It's horses for courses. In some industries it's accepted that you get what you're given. In others it's usual for vendors to supply data in exactly the format the customer requests.

There will be a cost associated but it may be better to pay that than to have your staff translating it etc...

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[MintJulep]

Firstly, you want everything in a searchable electronic format.

Native file formats such as .dwg or cad system of choice, Word, Excel, Visio, etc. Second choice would be generated (not scanned) PDF.

Scaned documents are useless in that you cannot use tools like Google desktop or native find features to find what you are looking for.

If signatures are important to you, then the signature page, and the signature page only should be scanned and inserted as an image into the electronic file.

For each piece of equipment, you want a fully indented BOM, down to the last nut, washer and wire terminal. For standard hardware and such you want a complete and unambiguous description. Exploded view illustrated parts catalog to go along with it.

You want a functional description that actually describes how the thing works. If it has software, you want the source code and a copy of whatever is necessary to modify it and recompile. Ideally you want a MatLab model of the system.

If it has "structure", you want the FEA model, not just the pretty results pictures, the model.

You want maintenance and overhaul instructions that are worth a damn.

 

[AusSteelMan]

Thanks every one for your input. I had most of it covered, but there were a couple of things where I was a more specific.

The Project Director is personally passionate about this topic. I think this is really why this task was a rehash of what basically mostly existed.

Thanks evryone again.
ASM