Profile (for a radius defined with ¦) used to control location, can also control the size? 1

[greenimi]

Is the profile initially designed/allocated to control location also control the size for the radius?

Has been discussed on this forum a couple of times (with even some controversy about 8.18 and 8.27 from Y14.5-2009 standard), but I would like to see how would you define the following –very simple—situation:

Radius size can be between .100/.040 (I know is defined with ± which is the controversy, but that’s the drawing I have). The form cannot be bigger than .010 (for example, if the radius on one side is .090 on any other side cannot be smaller than.080—that’s the intent)


We would like to control also the position of this radius to datum A which must be in .005.
The question is: if we add the profile control of .005 to A (intent to control the location) would that also control the size in .005 (and not in .010 which really we can live with)?

Thank you

 

[CheckerHater]

drawoh,
Imagine feature that is both off-round by its form and also eccentric in relation to datum
Your runout reading will be compound of both – you cannot separate them, but on the bright side you know for sure that either one of them is equal or less than runout value.
That’s what makes run-out popular – sometimes it is good enough and allows to replace more expensive procedures, or, after you are done with runot, you can refine your measurements further if necessary.

 

[greenimi]

Pmarc,
Re: "The thing is that even with runout tolerance applied to the surface, location of the surface, that is its distance from datum axis, would still be controlled by "sloppy" profile tolerance wrt A."

The GD&T callout proposed by drawoh wasn't

•A basic radius dimension
•A sloppy profile tolerance
•An accurate runout tolerance

And the sloppy profile was with no datum (he didn't really specified it if the profile was with or without datum, but was just my assumption)
So, location would be controlled by the runout and not by the profile, right? Am I missing something?

 

[pmarc]

greenimi,
My shot is that if profile was without a datum reference, such combination (profile + runout to A) would not really control distance of toleranced surface from datum axis A.
The distance would rather be dependent on size tolerance of bigger cylinder and its relationship to datum axis A based on tangency rule.