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oil leak gulf of mexico 5
- Thread starter CH5OH
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Red made his fame as a fireman who specialized in extinguishing fires, leaving sealing the well to the company hacks once it cooled off enough for them to get near the thing.
I'd do exactly as BP is trying now, capturing the leak while attempting to drill an intercepting well, then pump cement in to plug the original bore. That is a proven method to stop an uncontrolled well, at least at shallower depths.
What I would have done differently is simply to have a method to seal such leaks, already proven at or near that depth, ready to go in case of emergency, such as the "domes" they constructed during the last couple of weeks.
What I see as totally inexcusable is why 4 or 5 of these domes, or whatever technology they meant when they told the MMS that they could handle it, wern't already sitting ready and waiting at BP's supply docks, so that they would be available at a moment's notice. But then again, I doubt you'll find that part written down in the company procedure manual, so why should they have to think about that.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
I'd do exactly as BP is trying now, capturing the leak while attempting to drill an intercepting well, then pump cement in to plug the original bore. That is a proven method to stop an uncontrolled well, at least at shallower depths.
What I would have done differently is simply to have a method to seal such leaks, already proven at or near that depth, ready to go in case of emergency, such as the "domes" they constructed during the last couple of weeks.
What I see as totally inexcusable is why 4 or 5 of these domes, or whatever technology they meant when they told the MMS that they could handle it, wern't already sitting ready and waiting at BP's supply docks, so that they would be available at a moment's notice. But then again, I doubt you'll find that part written down in the company procedure manual, so why should they have to think about that.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
- Thread starter
- #3
What I see as totally inexcusable is why 4 or 5 of these domes, or whatever technology they meant when they told the MMS that they could handle it, wern't already sitting ready and waiting at BP's supply docks, so that they would be available at a moment's notice. But then again, I doubt you'll find that part written down in the company procedure manual, so why should they have to think about that.
I suppose when you start a project (building a rig) you don't start with a project in parallel (build a dome) in case the first project goes pear shaped
mmm...1500-2000bar on a well, 150bar water pressure
fitting a dome is like pushing a courk in a shaken champagne bottle
I suppose when you start a project (building a rig) you don't start with a project in parallel (build a dome) in case the first project goes pear shaped
mmm...1500-2000bar on a well, 150bar water pressure
fitting a dome is like pushing a courk in a shaken champagne bottle
There's not so much a relation to building the rig and a dome, and I can separate those two tasks in my mind, but drilling a well at any depth should require a proven mitigation plan and the equipment needed to implement that plan available at least somewhere in the world, if not nearby.
I'll bet they had the drill pipe, mud and supply boats ready and waiting at their yards.
But let's face facts. Drilling depth technology has outpaced environmental control technology. Before, they could wave the empty oil barrel and give from the full money barrel and ignore the consequences. Now they have to admit it.
The only good news about this is that green energy just got more competitive.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
I'll bet they had the drill pipe, mud and supply boats ready and waiting at their yards.
But let's face facts. Drilling depth technology has outpaced environmental control technology. Before, they could wave the empty oil barrel and give from the full money barrel and ignore the consequences. Now they have to admit it.
The only good news about this is that green energy just got more competitive.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
- Thread starter
- #5
to put it in the right perspective:
allmost all humans have an index finger,conveniant to point away from you.In that, the responsible party is quickly cornered.
Wouldn't it be possible to shoot a missile straight in the bore of the well, or would there be to much debris on top to reach enough depth?
At a pace of 800 ton leakage/day of environmental loss of well capacity a fast solution should be preferred.
allmost all humans have an index finger,conveniant to point away from you.In that, the responsible party is quickly cornered.
Wouldn't it be possible to shoot a missile straight in the bore of the well, or would there be to much debris on top to reach enough depth?
At a pace of 800 ton leakage/day of environmental loss of well capacity a fast solution should be preferred.
Perhaps a photon torpedo would work better under water.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
- Thread starter
- #7
It would be funny, if it wasn't true.
We shouldn't make light of this situation.
It is a disaster all around.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
We shouldn't make light of this situation.
It is a disaster all around.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
- Thread starter
- #9
I wasn't making light of the situation while suggesting the use of some kind of explosives.
putting a dome over a leak of 1500bar with a backpressure of 150bar.In order to get sealing pressure, the crude needs to be pumped out at a rate of 40 ton/hour to sea surface (to tanker 1500m discharge pipe)
then drill a side whole to drain the pressure
then pump concrete to a depth of 1500m, to fill the dome...
all provided good weather conditions...
remaining leak will be, below a concrete block
putting a dome over a leak of 1500bar with a backpressure of 150bar.In order to get sealing pressure, the crude needs to be pumped out at a rate of 40 ton/hour to sea surface (to tanker 1500m discharge pipe)
then drill a side whole to drain the pressure
then pump concrete to a depth of 1500m, to fill the dome...
all provided good weather conditions...
remaining leak will be, below a concrete block
All,
Bet the original risk assessment engineers for the drilling have made a hasty retreat - that is if any risk assessment was ever performed!!. If they are still around their rear ends must be giving it half crown/threepenny bits (Think it could be dollar/dimes - over the pond)
Bet the original risk assessment engineers for the drilling have made a hasty retreat - that is if any risk assessment was ever performed!!. If they are still around their rear ends must be giving it half crown/threepenny bits (Think it could be dollar/dimes - over the pond)
Closely followed by those who verified that the BOP was working when accepting the rig. BOPs have a reliability issue, particularly in the UK, suggesting that BP could have (and should have) known better.
On a related note, I wonder what Tony Hayward's and Andy Inglis's bonuses will be this year?
Steve Jones
Materials & Corrosion Engineer
On a related note, I wonder what Tony Hayward's and Andy Inglis's bonuses will be this year?
Steve Jones
Materials & Corrosion Engineer
I have been wondering what changes legislation will be making in light of these unfortunate circumstances. And what Bp will be doing to compensate the people affected, I guess they will have to figure out who to point the finger at before they will decide who's pocket books will be affected. Does any one know what could have prevented this situation and Say if under the same circumstances in another part of the world would this have been nipped in the bud before such a complete failure would have occured???
- Thread starter
- #14
DSB123,
i am affraid our hunger for more energy has made deep sea oil exploitation a profitable business.
the oil well leakage being collateral damage of a rig explosion/fire, which took the lives of 11 people, not the first to die at sea, not the last.Being surrounded by water, fire will remain the biggest disaster initiator.
I wouldn't have a clue, but i guess, while drilling a hole, concrete is used to fabricate a pipe, around the drill, while it's searching its way to an addittional depth of 5000m
reaching the well, the drill needs to be leakfree (?)retracted fore the same distance.the concrete pipe then gives foudation for a shut off valve, so the well can be exploited?
so the only thing being intact would be the concrete pipeline of about 5km?
i am affraid our hunger for more energy has made deep sea oil exploitation a profitable business.
the oil well leakage being collateral damage of a rig explosion/fire, which took the lives of 11 people, not the first to die at sea, not the last.Being surrounded by water, fire will remain the biggest disaster initiator.
I wouldn't have a clue, but i guess, while drilling a hole, concrete is used to fabricate a pipe, around the drill, while it's searching its way to an addittional depth of 5000m
reaching the well, the drill needs to be leakfree (?)retracted fore the same distance.the concrete pipe then gives foudation for a shut off valve, so the well can be exploited?
so the only thing being intact would be the concrete pipeline of about 5km?
The failure of the BOP is another mystery. I have heard that the BOP lacked the acoustic activator that some designs have. I also know that a BOP have a limited number of possible actions until the hydraulic fluid runs out - maybe the BOP was mal-operated during the explosion/fire and thus cant close unless hydraulic pressure is re-established?
Does anybody know if ROV's have been able to approach the BOP - or if it has been covered by debris/riser?
Best regards
Morten
Does anybody know if ROV's have been able to approach the BOP - or if it has been covered by debris/riser?
Best regards
Morten
Just from what I've seen on CNN, ROVs have been trying to operate the hydraulic activation valves for weeks now. One BOP might have partially stroked, as there was some reduction in leak rate, but could not shear through, or the seals failed, possibly due to distortion of the column, or a joint from the drill string is caught up inside jambing further action. Hydrates have plugged the first capture dome, so that didn't work.
Maybe the smaller dome that they're trying now will keep the velocity high enough so that the hydrates will be swept along, but that's pure supposition on my part.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
Maybe the smaller dome that they're trying now will keep the velocity high enough so that the hydrates will be swept along, but that's pure supposition on my part.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
- Thread starter
- #17
The lower temperature around the dome. If you can get the well stream to the surface before it has time to cool down, you can avoid crystalization.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
- Thread starter
- #19
so the oil burst out of the pipe, expands (velocity drop) cools down (4degC) and forms crystals
I was just thinking up loud, to use the fenomena to block the pipe, but maybe the tendency exist to control the leak and exploit the well, once the mess is cleared rather than sealing off the well to minimise the environmental impact, risking the well needs to be redrilled in order to exploit it.On land water (icing) and expanding CO2 is often used to block in a pipe with leaking valves.A hottap is often used to redirect a flow, without interupting it.I guess those techniques wouldn't be available at that depth?
I was just thinking up loud, to use the fenomena to block the pipe, but maybe the tendency exist to control the leak and exploit the well, once the mess is cleared rather than sealing off the well to minimise the environmental impact, risking the well needs to be redrilled in order to exploit it.On land water (icing) and expanding CO2 is often used to block in a pipe with leaking valves.A hottap is often used to redirect a flow, without interupting it.I guess those techniques wouldn't be available at that depth?
I've had hot taps done in a chamber at a hundred meters depth, but at 5000 ft, it might as well be on the outside surface of the International Space Lab, except with 2182 psia ambient pressure.
If you've ever tried to turn a wrench on a nut while scuba diving at only 50 ft depth without floating away and dropping and losing the wrench in the mud, you'd still have nowhere near the idea of the difficulty of doing even the simplest kind of work at 5000 ft.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
If you've ever tried to turn a wrench on a nut while scuba diving at only 50 ft depth without floating away and dropping and losing the wrench in the mud, you'd still have nowhere near the idea of the difficulty of doing even the simplest kind of work at 5000 ft.
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"The problem isn't finding the solution, its trying to get to the real question." BigInch
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