No SolidWorks 2006 Update 6

[cadman1997]

Hello Everyone

I would like to get some advice about the following issue, especially from the people in support or IS/IT. I have been told that we will not be updating to SolidWorks 2006. On top of that, they said that we will not be updating SolidWorks for 3 years, so that would mean no updates until SolidWorks 2009. I strongly believe that this the incorrect path that we should be following. I'm going to put a report together so, I can see if I can change their minds. I'm also studying for the CSWP Exam and think that this issue is going to change everything in regards to getting my CSWP. I would like to see what some other people think about this issue. Thank you for your comments.

Regards,

Ralph Wright, C.E.T.
Litens Automotive Group

 

[ctopher]

Do you pay for support?
I update always, including all SP's. I think it is necessary for fixing bugs. My company wanted at one time to stop paying support. I told them if they stopped, I will not support it. We still have it.
SolidWorks continually updates the software taking in our (users) suggestions. If you stay with the updates and send in your suggestions/enhancement requests, you will be ahead of the game.
If not, you will lag behind.

Chris, Sr. Mechanical Designer, CAD
SolidWorks 05 SP3.1 / PDMWorks 05
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716
FAQ1010-1130

 

[macPT]

cadman1997

It's not dramatic to stay on the same version for some time; in fact, it has some benefits. It's a question to compare the pros and cons.

I've done that and I think the results where positive.

When updating you have to consider 3 types of costs:
1 - the annual cost of the update
2 - the cost caused by the update implementation (testing, backup, converting, instaling, training)
3 - the cost caused by bugs in the new releases.

You must pay attention that cost #2 can be high (you should estimate in you case) and the cost #3 is becoming higher and higher. In the end, you can realize taht it's better to stay for a while in the same version. You must also consider that there are releases with very important improvments but there are also releases that don't add much to the previous (I am talking about real improvments, not new nice icons).

So, many of us prefer to stay in the same stable version for some time, maximizing the productivity. Some prefer to do that, even paying the annual subscription.

Of course that there are reasons that can compel you to continuously update. One of them is data exchange. Another is to be in the front line, an argument that I consider more marketing than real profit.

I'm not saying that you should not update. But you also should not update just because there is a new release. You should only update when it's proved that you will benefict from the bew release and the costs for the change will revert in your favour.

In conclusion, you must analyse your case carefuly and see if 3 years (I consider that the maximum admissible) in the same version will cause problems or not.

Regards

 

[cadman1997]

ctopher

Thank you for your comments. Yes, we pay for support.
We use the same VAR as CorBlimeyLimey. They have been
excellent, they have done anything I have asked them
for. I agree with you 110% about always keeping updated
with SPs, I do and I got hardly any problems. Most of my
problems are Network related, but I work on my C: Drive.
I have told them that if they do this, that they might
end up starting all over again from scratch. Some of the
Designers might require the Basic Training again. I'm
not sure if they wait that long if the Models and
Drawings will convert properly to SW2009. Do you think
that it might affect me passing the CSWP Exam?

Regards,

Ralph Wright, C.E.T.
Litens Automotive Group

 

[ctopher]

I also work over the network. Sometimes there are problems, but not as big as before when some users hard-drives crashed and lost alot of data. I had our company upgrade the network. Now very little problems, but not due to SolidWorks.
I'm not sure, but I think after you take the CSWP exam, you may have to stay updated every couple years. Others may know more about it.

Chris, Sr. Mechanical Designer, CAD
SolidWorks 05 SP3.1 / PDMWorks 05
ctopher's home site (updated 06-21-05)
FAQ559-1100
FAQ559-716
FAQ1010-1130

 

[Heckler]

I would like to include an item to macPT's list:

4 - The cost of hardware upgrades



Best Regards,

Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 3.1 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NIVIDA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)

"There is no trouble so great or grave that cannot be much diminished by a nice cup of tea" Bernard-Paul Heroux

 

[cadman1997]

macPT

Thank you for your comments. I have just completed the SW2006 Update Course (free) from i.get.it. There are a number of improvements that would affect my department. A number of complains from other Designers have been resovled in 2006 as far as I can see. I will be getting my full version of i.get.it this week and then can finish the SW2006 Update Course. One of the problems I have is that some of the Designers do not get the training that they require. I try my best to help everyone in the department because I would like to see everyone be the best they can. Also, I put SW in place for the department. I see the money side but, think that it would cost more in the long-term.

Regards,

Ralph Wright, C.E.T.
Litens Automotive Group

 

[cadman1997]

Heckler

Thank you for your comments. That is a good point because I did a Computer Upgrade Report when we were just starting to set SW up. The IS Department did do most of the things that I asked but, for one that I was hoping for the most. That was upgrading some of the computers (like RAM) on a yearly basic so they could keep up with the newer releases of SW. Over the last three years there has not been any upgrades at all. I got a fairly good computer myself:
P4, 2.53Ghz
60Gb Harddrive
1.5Gb RIMM RAM
ATI Fire GL 8800 card
Windows 2000 Pro, SP4.0
I keep it as clean as possible, backups and temp files. This way I can get the most out of my machine.

Regards,

Ralph Wright, C.E.T.
Litens Automotive Group

 

[Theophilus]

This question depends a lot on each release and how you use SolidWorks.

I, for instance, am champing at the bit for each release in hopes of improved rendering (PhotoWorks), surfacing, and spline handling. So I upgrade all the time like ctopher--after getting some opinions of SP stability from this forum and elsewhere--and enjoy the increased productivity these enhanced features provide.

If you back up all your files before running to the next major release, you have no chance of losing anything but what you put into your parts after the release conversion. So a lot of the testing can be done on the fly after a database back-up (which should be current anyway).

Also, you'll get hit with a reinstatement fee if you wait too long to pay maintenance after stopping maintenance. I'm not sure what the specific fees are, but I think they progressively increase to a point. So if you decide not to upgrade, it may pay to keep maintenance current or it may not--depending upon the fee schedule. Check with your VAR before making this decision.


Jeff Mowry

http://www.industrialdesignhaus.com

Reality is no respecter of good intentions.

 

[CorBlimeyLimey]

Skipping one upgrade is no big deal, you can quite easily catch up with the new stuff.

Skipping two, might be pushing it, the "rate" (qty & type) of change is increasing. I believe the complexity of changes will also increase over the next few years, as the user base is expecting more & more sophistication.

I think a 3 or 4 upgrade skip is definitely too long. We went from SW01 to SW04. Quite a difference. I was lucky in that I had contacts with other people who had the in between versions I could experiment (play) with. Had I not had those contacts it would have been a real PITA to catch up "on-the-fly".

Does your company have add-on programmes? (FEA, PDM, etc)
Have they taken into account how those (if updated) will interact with older versions of SW?
If they don't update those until they update SW, have they thought about how the users will also have to get up to speed with those too?


Making the best use of this Forum. faq559-716
How to get answers to your SW questions. faq559-1091
Helpful SW websites every user should be aware of. faq559-520

 

[SBaugh]

thread559-113226

Maybe someone can help me find it, but there was a thread that I posted (which I have been unable to find) about why you wouldn't want to skip upgrades. Does anyone know what thread that is?

Certification:
thread559-126218

Regards,

Scott Baugh, CSWP
3DVision Technologies

http://www.3dvisiontech.com

http://www.scottjbaugh.com

faq731-376

 

[cadman1997]

Theophilus, CorBlimeyLimey, and SBaugh

Thank you for your comments. I read this forum all the time and do alot of things that are suggested here which has improved my system and knowledge of SW. On this issue I strongly feel that we should not skip new releases or SPs. We design everything in-house, tooling, machines and transfer lines.
Theophilus, we backup our whole system before going to new releases plus, I get the new releases and SPs first and do testing on-the-fly. The reinstatement fee is another thing that I plan on bringing up in my report.
CorBlimeyLimey, the issue about the Designers getting up to speed for SW2009, if they do this issue of not updating, I believe that the department will take a huge step backwards. Some of the Designers will be starting from scratch. They will require the Basic Training Course again. I also believe that the lead times for our designs will increase because the Designers have to get use to SW2009. I'm not sure if they realize that if they wait that some of Models and Drawings will not convert to SW2009. We have the basic package but another department has COSMOSWorks.
SBaugh, I agree with you 110% that we should not skip upgrades. Thanks again for your comments, they are greatly appreciated.

Regards,

Ralph Wright, C.E.T.
Litens Automotive Group

 

[J-C]

Why to upgrade each release:

New features reduces workarounds and time.
Easier to digest new features and changes one release at a time.
Easier to manage file conversion one release at a time.



Why not to upgrade each release:

May need to upgrade hardware.
Day or two lost for training users to cover the changes.
Increased IT support rolling out upgrades.
Unknown issues, causing workarounds.

Jason

 

[MadMango]

In my company we skipped SW04 entirely. We went from SW03 to SW05. There was a drastic change to the UI, and this caused some considerable loss of productivity from everyone that used SW. Luckily, in less than 2 wks everyone was pretty much "back to speed."

We decided not to change versions because we were in the middle of several large projects, and it was determined that it was going to be better to finish the projects with the version we had. We only changed versions after the projects were completed.

The core functions and processes of SW has not changed since I started using SW96+. I think if your users have a solid (no pun intended) foundation of using your current version of SW, they should have no problem adjusting to any UI changes. The hard part is getting people to use the newer features that have been added in a new version. These new features usually increase productivity, but are tied to increased hardware requirements. Be prepared to not only upgrade the software when the time comes, but also your computers, especially if you are going to skip whole versions of SW.

[green]"I think there is a world market for maybe five computers."[/green]
Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943.
Have you read faq731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[J-C]

Most companies should be on a plan to upgrade CAD workstations regularly, especially if they pushing the performance envelope (Large assys, complex parts, etc.)

With that said, when I left my previous employer last August, most users were still using the 600mhz Pentium 3s that we implemented Solidworks 99 with. Was a chore trying to tweak those PCs to run 2004-2005 with little problems. Some of them where running in OpenGL mode due to the old Wildcat video cards not having newer drivers that were compatible with the newer version of swx.

Made my case, provided productivity numbers, still couldn't get the $$$ to upgrade. Of course they weren't interested in saving money by getting the job done quicker, they wanted to know how many people could we could cut. Soft vs. hard dollars.

Jason

 

[Theophilus]

I just thought of something else--depends whether your company plans to pay maintenance during this non-upgrade time. You can run a separate machine with the upgraded versions as a sort of test horse. If all goes well, you can make the pitch to management to implement the upgrades company-wide.

If, however, the issue is only the maintenance fee, I think your company should evaluate whether they're in the right business.

I look back 18 months ago when I finally upgraded my P3, 666 MHz machine (similar to Gildashard's, marketed as 667 MHz) and regret that I didn't upgrade sooner. With increased output I can more than buy back the price of new hardware or software at the time that such hardware or software will provide the most benefit--namely, when I get the biggest advantage over competition. (That doesn't happen three years after release.)

I'm continually amazed at the short-sighted decisions made by medium-to-large companies (typically in the Dilbert zone) these days--and even more amazed that they remain in the marketplace with smaller, quicker competitors such as myself. I guess I don't eat as much.


Jeff Mowry

http://www.industrialdesignhaus.com

Reality is no respecter of good intentions.

 

[cadman1997]

Gildashard, MadMango, and Theophilus

Thank you for your comments. I try to keep up to date with everything related to SW.
Gildashard, I did a Computer Upgrade Report 3 years ago and stated in it that the IS department should do some yearly upgrades to our department's computers so we could keep up with the increasing demand required by SW. They have not done any upgrades in the last 3 years as far as I know of. When a new release of SW comes out and we have it installed on our computers, I have our VAR come in and do 2 Update Sessions for all of our Designers, about 2 weeks after the installation. The Designers can get use to the new release and will have questions or want to know something else. Our VAR does this updating free of charge. They also help with new release installation if we require help. One thing that I do is send our VAR some Assemblies. Models, and Drawings and have SolidWorks test them for converting them to the new release.
MadMango, I would like to keep the learning curve going up for our Designers with knowledge of SW, but some people are not as good as others but, that is to be expected. If we do not update for 3 years I feel that some of the Designers that do not have as much SW knowledge will lose out the most. Their lead times for their projects will grow longer and the company will lose in the end.
Theophilus, as far as I know at this point they are going to cancel the maintenance agreement also. I believe this to be a big hit for our Designers, and I include myself when say Designers because I'm not a IS guy but a Designer. I try to assist everyone in my department plus help out anyway I can. I submit SW improvements like training, computer upgrades and tips and tricks. I for one want to be the best I can be in using SW that is why I want get my CSWP. Again thanks for your comments.

Regards,

Ralph Wright, C.E.T.
Litens Automotive Group

 

[Theophilus]

Aaaaarrrgh! No maintenance at all? Hang in there.

If nothing else, keep up on the major new releases by downloading the "What's New" document from the SolidWorks site. This will at least keep you generally familiar with the progress of SolidWorks and allow you to anticipate the features you'll want to use. (I certainly don't use every new feature that comes along. Many I learn when I need to know them, such as design tables [I'm an industrial designer, not an engineer, per se, so I don't make lots of variations on a them]. Some features I can't wait to try out and push to the limits.)

Perhaps you can get your CSWP before your licenses become severely out of date. I recommend doing so, if that's a goal you want to pursue. You can worry about keeping the certification after you get it. Who knows? You may be working for someone else by that time anyway.


Jeff Mowry

http://www.industrialdesignhaus.com

Reality is no respecter of good intentions.

 

[cadman1997]

Theophilus

Some people in the IS department said that I got nothing to worry about with the cancelling of the maintenance agreement. I totally disagree with them on this issue. I plan on doing the CSWP Exam at christmas time. There are alot of things that I got to know but can not use them in my everyday designs because some of the other people do not know SW as good as I do. I teach the others some easier ways to do their designs with the newer features added. They like that part. I just asked our VAR to sign me up for i.get.it training, I did the free one and thought that it was a great studying and training tool for SW. I was in the beta program last year and found it rewarding to use the new release before being released to the public. Thanks again for your assistance.

Regards,

Ralph Wright, C.E.T.
Litens Automotive Group