Need Advice on Steel Cantilevered Canopy Roof Members

[Blacky199]

Hey All,
In the early stages of designing a glass pavillion residence. One thats practical as well as pleasing to the eye. What i am trying to achieve with the design is a complete transparent dwelling that has minimal visual impact on the property. Consequently the house is basically all glass external walls with a canopy roof. i have included a fin wall that structure can be concealed in and have also strategically placed columnalong the joinery unit central dividing the master bedroom and secondary bedrooms. As its in the initial stages of designi would just like some feedback as to whether this is possible to achieve. Would be great if you could think outside the box and stretch your imagination so that i dont have to include columns along the exterior perimeter of the building to support the roof. would be great if you could provide some feedback if its possible and if its not then how i would go about acheiving somethjing similar and what size columns and beams are required. also perhaps the depth that the columns would have to be founded to support the huge cantilevers. Thanks

 

[Blacky199]

Here is the basic early stages floor plan design.

 

[msquared48]

I would consider extending the central column above the roof structure a few feet and extending a cable or tension member from the other column, across the top of the central column to the tip of the cantilever beam to limit the vertical deflection there.

Will also have to consider uplift on the cantilever too.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering
Motto: KISS
Motivation: Don't ask

 

[hokie66]

There are some excellent structural engineers in Melbourne, and some of them wouldn't laugh at you.

 

[csd72]

Blacky199,

You need to pick a good structural engineer and get them involved early in the design.

Glass is very sensitive to any structural movement and an in depth analysis would be required to ensure that this is not an issue.

The depth of the column foundations depends on the buildings location (is it a cyclone region?) and the type of soil.

This is not the place to get free design advice.

 

[dik]

Interesting concept...

North to the top... do you have no support in the northwest corner?

Do you have rain/snow loads, what sort of wind conditions? Seismic?

What is the construction material? Does it 'creep' with time?

Lateral loading may generate torsional loads that have to be resisted.

YOu also have to provide connections at the top of your perimeter glazing wall to accommodate roof deflections (which can be significant if you have any severe loading conditions). Some interesting details.

The forumguys are correct in seeking engineering help at an early stage. He may address some of the above and perhaps other issues.

Interesting concept...

Dik

 

[Blacky199]

Cheers for the feedback guys.
Definately not after "free" design advice. was after more of some directional feedback which i have received. Was worried that it might have been a laughable concept, however from this feedback it seems i could be in the ball park with some serious detailing. definately need to engage an engineer at this early stage if i want to head down this track. Will seek out some reputable structural engineers in the area. It seems that i have only dealt with one type of structural engineers, the ones that work against you and not with you. good to hear that they are some out there that will go to the lengths to help you acheive what im after.

 

[csd72]

Yes, you definately need to pick the right type of engineer. I would suggest someone who does a lot of glass structures. A call to IEAust may help.

I am sure I recall a similar concept in one of the engineering magazines where the support frame was the shape of a tree. It was a pilates studio in Sydney I believe (but dont quote me on that). It may be worth seeing if you can find the article and the engineer that did that.

Good luck.

 

[Blacky199]

Great... Just did some research and that studio was done by Undercurrent Architects in Sydney. will do some follow up and see if i can undercover the engineer. Great Design though. amazing stuff. works well with the rural theme... Thanks Mate!

 

[Blacky199]

If any one is interested in the construction of the Sydney leaf house this video is excellent -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7xQ3W8n-bc

 

[Blacky199]

elliotwood partnership was the engineers involved. UK Based FYI. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction csd72!!!

 

[csd72]

No worries!

 

[MiketheEngineer]

People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

Are the bedrooms & bath all glass?

 

[hawkaz]

Meis Van Der Rohe did one like this near Chicago (but with exterior columns)- Look up the Farnsworth House

 

[trainguy]

I suspect many structural engineers would want to work with you IF you're paying them by the hour, not a fixed price. This is an unconventional structure that will have to be modified, and a substantial amount of time would need to be devoted to negotiating design changes with the arch and owner.

I have trouble visualizing how this structure could work, given the absence of load path (columns), for gravity and esp. lateral loads.

Designing glass panes to properly function within a very flexible structure is a challenge.

tg

 

[a2mfk]

I'd also want a good mechanical engineer on board so that thing is not a greenhouse...