How do employers view online master's programs? 9

[Lion06]

Can anyone in a hiring role (or management position) give any insight as to how an online structural (or any other discipline for that matter) engineering degree is looked upon? I am considering U of Idaho because it will allow me to "attend" class on my own schedule, but don't want to spend the time if it is looked down on by colleagues and managers.

 

[JAE]

StructuralEIT,

I've been in a role of hiring for some time and I have to say I've always steered more towards M.S. degree candidates.

There are good, strong engineers with the B.S. only but for me personally I really became a much better engineer with my M.S.

For online M.S. degrees, if I was confronted with two otherwise equal candidates and one had an "in school" M.S. and the other an online M.S., I would most likely go with the "in school" person.

My direct contact with my professors on a daily basis, my exposure to other students on a deily basis, the exposure to research in the lab, etc. all offer a superior experience in my opinion.

In addition, I know what graduate schools out there have high reputations in Structural Engineering and I'd question a school's stature if it offered an online program or ONLY offered an onlline program....don't know that I can describe why, or back it up, but maybe just because of my own experience and what I know to be true.

So what I'm saying is - for your direct question on whether an online program would be looked down upon by other managers, I'd say on average yes. That doesn't mean an online program isn't good or beneficial. It's just that there are many engineers out there that would be unaware of how good the online format is and be suspicious.

 

[swivel63]

depends on the university. but i'd still look at it kind of cockeyed if it was online.

 

[davidbeach]

A degree on a resume is a degree on a resume. Frankly, the outreach degree from a reputable institution, such as U of I mentioned by the OP, is more of an achievement than one taken on campus. On campus the course work is your principal priority. The outreach approach (not online per se) means fitting in all the work of a graduate level course around the rest of your life. It is not a walk in the park.

 

[JAE]

davidbeach, you might be right, but I don't think the issue is whether the online degree takes more effort. The important issue is whether those who get through an online MS degree program carry the same quality of credentials, knowledge, skills, etc. compared to other who go through an on-campus degree program....on average.

 

[Lion06]

I live in the Philadelphia area, so my other option would be a master's at Villanova. I don't know how that program is viewed outside of the area, but I like it because no math or physics are required (not that I have anything againt them, but I don't view anything above and beyond what I have already taken as being very helpful to me). I could take (10) structural engineering design and analysis classes for the degree. The problem there is cost. While my employer would pay for some, it is a fraction of the total cost (less than 1/3).

 

[Lion06]

JAE-
A star for you for your honest and insightful post. Could you give me a quick list of the better structural engineering master's programs (in your opinion)? If Drexel and/or Villanova are not on the list, please tell me how you view them.
Can I ask what area of the country you are in?

 

[kontiki99]

I looked at on line masters programs a couple of times. I started once or twice, but haven't finished. I did find the additional training valuable and would like to try again.

I think there are two objectives, get good training and get the most widely recognized credential. If your going to make the sacrifice, might as well get as much value from it as you can.

I decided on the following method for my next attempt:

Go to the US News and World Report on top engineering graduate schools
- >

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/edu/grad/rankings/eng/brief/engrank_brief.php

Start at the top of the list and work down to find the best university that offers a distance learning program in the field I’m interested in.

Look for a degree that is indistinguishable from the degree students receive if they attend on campus.

Good Luck,

 

[JAE]

StructuralEIT

Check this out. I'm not saying their rankings are accurate by any mesns but it at least offers a rough layout of good schools.

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/edu/grad/rankings/eng/brief/engrank_brief.php

 

[Qshake]

StructuralEIT -

I am in the same position of hiring as JAE and hire MS only for structural analysis and design work.

My opinions of advanced degrees through distance education depends mainly on what I'm looking for. For example if our need is a design position then I'm open to a distance education with a Masters by way of examination. If we require advance concepts or familiarity with laboratory work then I look for traditional education.

As for the institution, I'm a big fan of what you put into it is more important that where you received your degree. That does require a lot of interaction in the interview process. I do like to be thorough.

Regards,
Qshake

Eng-Tips Forums:Real Solutions for Real Problems Really Quick.

 

[JAE]

Hey - one other dimension to this, which Qshake reminded me of, is that at my own grand university, I had the choice as to go either thesis or non-thesis for the MS degree.

The theory at the time was that a non-thesis was presented more for those who would go on to consulting, whereas the thesis option was for those planning to continued on with a Ph.D., research, or teaching.

I went non-thesis. The online degrees naturally may tend to be more non-thesis as you cannot perform on-site research projects. I've never, as a hiring person, worried too much about the thesis vs. non-thesis status of my interviewees, but I would think the focus of the non-thesis might be more geared towards practice vs. research.

 

[Lion06]

Well, you have certainly given me much to ponder. I am sort of feeling a little substandard at the moment knowing how most of you feel about those of us engineers without a master's. It is definitely good information to be armed with, though.
JAE and Qshake-
Do you both have these opinons regardless of circumstances? For example, would you rather see someone who got a B.S. and M.S. without working between or see the M.S. after some real world experience?
Also, I don't think the U of Idaho program is "online" so much as it is distance education. The recorded classes would be sent on dvd and all homeworks and proctered tests are still due.
How do you feel about certificate programs for people who aren't interested in the broader M.S.? I have noticed that an increasing number of schools are offering "Structural Engineering Certificates" as an alternative to a master's. This usually involves 6-8 structural analysis and design classes without the physics and math classes.
Finally, do you feel that people learn things in a master's program that they won't learn on the job? Does it just give you greater confidence in their abilities? Does your opinion on this phase out with engineers who have more experience (say 8-10 years)?
Thanks for letting me pick your brains!!

 

[swivel63]

there's a book on best grad programs in the nation for specific engineering disiplines as well. that list is for overall as a college.

 

[JAE]

StructuralEIT,

I would welcome Qshake's and others opinions on this as well, here's a few thoughts:

How do you feel about certificate programs - never heard of them but I would certainly value someone's 6-8 structural classes post B.S. degree.

...do you feel that people learn things in a master's program that they won't learn on the job? - I did. What happened with me is that I came back through the MS program and all sorts of light bulbs started going off in my head. Structural analysis began to make sense. I understood the relationship between the Flexibility method and the Stiffness Method. I understood matrix analysis, post-tensioned concrete, plastic design, and dynamics. Essentially, my MS degree took my rudimentary B.S. knowledge and converted it into real tools that I could apply to real projects.

Does it just give you greater confidence in their abilities? Not just....but actually gives me confidence that they have a good grasp of engineering principles. This is not to say that those with B.S. degrees don't...many do very well and I'm sure there are better engieners than I with just the B.S. degree. But my own personal experience with grad school tells me that very few who do have the M.S. will come out of grad school lacking in skills.

Does your opinion on this phase out with engineers who have more experience (say 8-10 years)?
- To some extent yes, but that depends a whole lot on three things:
1. The individual - i.e. do they continue to self-educate themselves - seriously studying codes, design methods, etc.
2. The kinds of projects they have to work on.
3. The mentors they get to work under.

One last thing - I worked two years for a design firm (in-office design and out on the construction sites) between my B.S and my M.S. and that certainly helped me understand how my pretty pictures actually get built.

 

[swivel63]

i went non-thesis as well.....and just TA'd introductory mechanics to pay the bills. and we had to take more classes than the thesis guys.

 

[Lion06]

swivel-
what is the name of that book?

 

[swivel63]

the actual us news and world report book, lol....i guess i should have been more specific. you can find it borders or barnes and noble. it lists the top 10 programs (not sure how they come up with it) in each field from CE to ME to CHME, ect. it has a sea blue cover on it. the undergrad lists is an orange book. it doesn't exactly separate into specific practices like structural or transpo, though.

 

[JAE]

StructuralEIT - check out the link I posted above.

 

[cksh]

To answer the original question about online degrees. How would they know you attended classes online unless you told them or the school was obvious (U of Pheonix etc)? Most online degrees I have looked into give you the same exact degree as on campus students. It is not worded differently.

You have the same teacher, same homework and same tests. I might pursue an online MSEM. It is a local school, but I would much rather have my own schedule then worry about finding the classes I need at night and spending another hour on the road commuting back and forth.

And, as someone said, the classes aren't necesarily easier online. And you will find yourself without help if your communication is not kept up.

I will most likely be going non-thesis. Since I am going with an online degree a thesis kind of defeats the purpose of giving me more free time with my family. In addition to classes about the thesis I would have to be writing my butt off! Difficult with a two year old

My company will not even ask if I have to write one. Some schools don't even offer them.

 

[Lion06]

cksh-
I wouldn't volunteer that it is an online degree, but if I live and work in the Philadelphia area and my degree is not from a Philadelphia area school, it is pretty obvious. I would not be picking a non-local school on purpose, I just have not found a local school with a master's program that is not on-campus.


All-
Does anyone have any pointers for finding out if a school has an online (or any kind of distance education) master's program? I search through many college websites but can not come across this information easily.