House Review - Site Visit without report?

[Ben29]

Would you do a cursory review of a house without providing a report? I was contacted by a man who just wants a SE to walk a house with him that he is interested in purchasing. He doesn't want to pay for a report. Quite frankly I don't want to do a report because they are so time consuming. But I am interested in walking the house to point out structural issues that I see.

It all comes down to liability, I know. So if you feel a report is absolutely required, how can you write a report in such a way that it takes less than an hour and also has CYA verbiage built in?

 

[ANE91]

It is hard for me to believe any judge would side with the customer on this. It is a he said - she said situation. Especially since the customer chose not to get a written report.

It very much depends on the state, whether a jury is involved, etc.

 

[ANE91]

Excellent point, (even better, cursory review) it is funny how simple words can get you in trouble with a crafty lawyer. One of the biggest problems with defending your methodology and reporting skills in a deposition is when you get questions you weren't expecting and start your response with "Well, ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh".

I see here you say it was "most likely not an issue", so you admit there was a reasonable chance it was an issue. Well, Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

They have degrees in arguing. It’s their job to find something with which to critique you. You’re winning if they’re attacking your credentials, because it means that they found nothing else worth digging into.

 

[jerseyshore]

We do site visits only from time to time for people who don't want a formal letter. Sometimes we'll do short emails.

Single family residential is high liability no matter what we do. There's a reason why insurance costs are so damn high even for small outfits. Performing a site visit and not writing a letter barely changes that IMO. Most times I will still take photos so that I can go back and say "these are the things I looked at".

Only once did I have someone come back and say "I'm selling my house, remember 2 years ago when you said my 30 ft tall 4-tier railroad tie retaining wall is fine, can you write a report?". Yeah no.

 

[XR250]

We do site visits only from time to time for people who don't want a formal letter. Sometimes we'll do short emails.

Single family residential is high liability no matter what we do. There's a reason why insurance costs are so damn high even for small outfits. Performing a site visit and not writing a letter barely changes that IMO. Most times I will still take photos so that I can go back and say "these are the things I looked at".

Only once did I have someone come back and say "I'm selling my house, remember 2 years ago when you said my 30 ft tall 4-tier railroad tie retaining wall is fine, can you write a report?". Yeah no.

Basically same here. I have started showing my liability limitation on the invoice (fees collected). That way when they pay the bill, they have agreed to it.

 

[jerseyshore]

Basically same here. I have started showing my liability limitation on the invoice (fees collected). That way when they pay the bill, they have agreed to it.

Not a bad idea. Another local engineer that mostly does residential work has a nice little paragraph at the end of all of his reports that that summarizes what is and is not included in the evaluation, report, etc. It's something I'd like to start incorporating into our reports or even invoices is decent idea too.

 

[XR250]

This is what is at the bottom of my "non-verbal" consultation reports...

The conclusions reached in this report are based upon the condition of the structure at the time of the review. No warranty as to the future performance of any item is expressed or implied. No areas of the structure were reviewed other than those discussed in the report. The review was performed in accordance with generally accepted engineering principles and practices and used a standard of care consistent with other local design professionals limited by the scope and budget. No destructive or invasive testing or review of mold and mildew was performed. All opinions are subject to revision based on new or additional information. No responsibility will be taken for conditions that could not be easily seen or are outside the scope of this review. Any use which a third party makes of this report, or any reliance upon, decisions made in response to or in any way influenced by this report are the responsibility of such third party.. This report was billed hourly and has a liability limitation of 10 times fees collected. It represents the best judgment of XXXXX given the information available at the time of writing.

 

[racookpe1978]

I just spent a day on a Negligence & Liability course and they used an example that was similar to this.
The homeowner sued the pants off the engineer and the engineer had nothing in writing he could fall back on to prove his vague recollections.

Terrible idea, I would not recommend it. What you have is a client who wants the world but isn't willing to pay for it. Any decent client would understand that they should expect something in writing. Otherwise I guarantee you are getting in for a world of hurt, especially because residential pre purchase inspections are SO RISKY at the best of times (at least in this part of the world).

Now, a reasonable compromise is that you don't write a full report and just do a long email or a summary letter or something - we have done this several times before. It's just a statement of facts/observations and potential risks. You are careful to avoid definitive conclusions as to what the client should do - that's their job to figure out.

I wouldn't even do this for friends - heck, for my own brother I wrote him a 7 page report when I did a pre purchase inspection. I really think you're opening yourself up to an excessive risk for such little monetary gain.

Also very relevant: If you do no report now, YOU have no realistic way of effectively charging (later) for your time when the report is needed. (Lawsuit, claim, liability, taxes, assessment or rebate or tax changes or loan or total collapse or insurance claim - whatever.) "Oh wait, I can get you a report .. In four days." isn't going to satisfy a enemy lawyer's filing.

 

[ViaParadise]

As a very young and inexperienced engineer I have a question here for those answering this topic that is more of a situation than question. If you do in fact want to make money as an engineer on the side, and occasionally wouldn't mind walking through homes with someone. If not to say, "yes the floor/roof/whatever is likely supported like this so if you wanted/need to change/fix it you may end up needing to do such and such", at least just to tell the homeowner what you may see that is alarming but may be a non-issue upon further inspection. How would you do this? It seems like the answer to this question and similarly OP's is "don't, the client is not your friend and any desire to help should be disuaded by the possibility of being sued by those both too ignorant and arrogant of what an engineer can and can't do". Beyond the money, doing something like this does seem fun as a little side job and also even charitable in being able to give people your opinion in the hopes that it helps them buy a home. But, if the result is just litigation ending in stress, lost time and money, and even licensure issues then it seems ridiculously difficult to even TRY and be a 'good' engineer in this way.

 

[XR250]

Honestly, I have been primarily in the residential space since 1991 and have yet to be sued. Was threatened once with a lawsuit from a customer who was a lawyer but it never came to fruition.