Friend did a stupid 2

[msquared48]

Friend had a clog in the drain line for his kitchen sink and I'm glad he's still here.

He COMBINED, if you can believe it, Draino, Liquid Plumber, and Carbolic Acid in the drain, and it "exploded" to quote it precisely - devevoped a lot of pressure, caustic fumes, and foam.

After sealing up the drain access, he contacted an emergency room doctor. The doctor looked it up (surprises me that they would have that exact combination) and recommended neutralizing the mixture with Vinegar, which he subsequently used. The unknowns are the concentration, and what was in the drain causing the clog.

I wonder what caustic gas might have been generated (I strongly suspect Cyanide gas, and perhaps ammonia, but I'm not sure), and if Vinegar would really be the proper neutralizing agent here. I realize that Draino and Liquid Plumber are strong bases, and that Carbolic acid and vinegar are acids. The chemical results are beyond me though.

The problem now is that the vents cannot be opened too clear the clog until the reaction ceases, hence the need to neutralize properly.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

http://mmcengineering.tripod.com

 

[Rich2001]

One, he is lucky to be alive.


Drano - sodium hydroxide (lye), sodium nitrate, sodium chloride (salt), aluminum
LiquidPlumbr - 0.5–2% sodium hydroxide, 5–10% sodium hypochlorite, and a surfactant

Some of the gasses formed would include Hydrogen, Ammonia, and Water vapor, However, the chemical reaction is very exothermic resulting some of the original chemicals and intermediates being dispersed. The chemical ratio is unbalanced resulting in not all the primary chemical being used up, hence neutralizing the mixture with Vinegar.

Standard safety precautions, gloves, eye protection, lab apron ( to protect your torso. as Hydrogen will be produce in unknown amounts, no open flames, turning electrical switches on/off. If the Vinegar can be added remotely all the better.

I know someone, due to a stunt like this lost 3 fingers when he added the acid to the mixture, very lucky he did not lose his life.

I suspect that the plumbing will have to be replaced. clogged with salts and unused cleaners. Hire a professional.

Richard

http://www.6sproductivitycom.com

 

[Latexman]

And, carbonic acid would release carbon dioxide.

Good luck,
Latexman

 

[Compositepro]

Carbolic (not carbonic) acid is phenol. There are a number of Draino and Liquid Plumber products with different formulations, so its difficult to comment on this. The danger level is often highly exaggerated. The fumes are probably either chlorine gas, ammonia, or simply a highly caustic mist in the air. While these are highly toxic they are also extremely irritating so it is unlikely for someone to breathe a dangerous amount prior to evacuation of the room. What makes the news is that evacuation is required, so people notice when it occurs in public areas.

 

[msquared48]

From what I heard, he auromatically evacuated from both ends. Thanks guys.

Sometimes self-education is not good, right?

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

http://mmcengineering.tripod.com

 

[rmw]

It is a wonder I made it (we made it) through my childhood what with all the stuff we used to mix together to watch the reactions.

The cool guy on the block was a kid that had some elemental phosphorous. Cool stuff - interesting reactions, think hand grenades. It had to be kept in some type of oil or something.

Like I said - it is a wonder.

rmw

 

[msquared48]

White phosphorus? If so, real nasty stuff.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

http://mmcengineering.tripod.com

 

[rmw]

Whatever it was, it was real nasty stuff. Just taking the lump of it out of the oil long enough to cut small pieces off to do our experimentation with set it to smoking pretty seriously.

rmw

 

[DubMac]

Hard to believe we lived through one of the older hoods in the neighborhood teaching us runts the memorable joys of mixing sulfur, saltpeter, and charcoal.........very explosive.

Quickly backed off to the much more benign mixture of saltpeter and sugar to make smoke bombs. Ahh yes, the joy of filling up an empty Coke can with that mixture, dropping a match in it and throwing it up in the air..... can still hear the magnificent whistling sound as it streaked up, up, and away..... where it landed we never knew....

 

[MiketheEngineer]

We used to mix hydrocloric acid with zinc to make hydrogen. Filled up dry cleaner bags, added a few firecrackers with a cigarette fuse and let them fly.

This was the mid- 1960's. Let them off at dusk and sure enough after about 5 minutes the firecrackers would go off - sometimes the whole balloon. More than one UFO was mentioned in the local newspaper!!

 

[bimr]

The hypochlorite in Liquid Plumber is incompatible with the Carbolic Acid.

Caustic drain cleaners react with aluminum, rubber, zinc and brass. A caustic drain cleaner may react with garbage disposals that have rubber or aluminum parts. Caustic drain cleaners react with active metals like aluminum, tin and zinc to release hydrogen gas, which is highly flammable and explosive.

Caustic drain cleaners also have an exothermic reaction with water.

 

[MiketheEngineer]

Next time call Roto-Rooter - for $100 they do a great SAFE job!!

 

[rmw]

I don't think Roto-Rooter has ever done anything at my place for as cheap as $100.00.

rmw

 

[ScottyUK]

Talking about crazy ways of clearing drains, the bar I worked in when I was a kid had a hose with a sink plug fitted to one end by some sort of adapter, and a connection to a CO₂ cylinder from the cellar on the other. The cylinder connection was straight through unregulated! We used to use this thing to clear the bar sinks of all the crap which collected in the drains and blow it through - the manager would have the cylinder and hose, and we'd be holding the plugs in the other sinks on the common drain while he cracked the cylinder valve open. A couple of the girls got drenched with crud out of the waste. I was a bit heavier so my plug never lifted.

Looking back I realise how risky what we were involved with actually was. Just seemed routine at the time...


----------------------------------

If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!

 

[Rich2001]

I remember an incident at work 25 years ago. The maintenance manager had been working all morning on a stubborn clogged drain line was using compressed in the shop to clear it. Unfortunately, the clog was not where he thought it was. To his surprise, and several others, there were other branches tying in before the clog. For he applied more and more compressed air the toilets in the front office erupted like volcanoes ... his girlfriend was using one at the time. I can still remember the expression on her face as she came running down the hall, screaming and drenched, to his office, across from mine.

Richard

http://www.6sproductivitycom.com

 

[MiketheEngineer]

Yeah - Roto-Rooter's prices have jumped - but you get my drift!!

Let them get hurt - not you

 

[DubMac]

Just used a 100' motorized snake last week to unclog kitchen drain. Rented it for $45; done in one hour.

Next time I may try the CO2 bottle, that sounds more funner.

 

[MiketheEngineer]

You could do a kitchen or toilet drain with a self propelled snake for about $25. I own a couple of them - because people are always borrowing them....

BTW - they make a specific one for toilets - use it - it works much better.

 

[msquared48]

Mikde:

You need to come up with a snake long enough to get to you neighbor's toilet. Can you imagine the fun you could have with that?

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

http://mmcengineering.tripod.com

 

[MiketheEngineer]

Tickle the pickle??!!