Certified Weld Inspector Question 1

[ChipFuller]

We are trying to update our policy at our plant for welding. I'm struggling with when do I need a certified weld inspector and a certified welder.

For example, do I need both a certified inspector and certified welder to weld a piece of unistrut for a simple repair?

Should the engineer classify on the drawing the need for certified welder and inspection?

Do all certified welds require a certified weld inspector for visual or mag-paricle or dye penetrant?

Any thoughts would be a appreciated.

 

[gtaw]

There are few welding codes that require the involvement of a CWI. However, most welding standards and codes do require the welder to be qualified by testing. It is typical for the welding standard to make the employer responsible to ensure the welder is properly qualified by signing (i.e., certifying) the performance/qualification test record.

The employer can typically qualify the welder in-house if they have the ability to do so or they can use the services of a third party, i.e., a CWI, to help them with the task. The pitfall is still the employer's responsibility to ensure the welder is qualified per the requirements of the applicable welding standard. To say it another way, many welding standards do not recognize the qualification/certification performed by the third party. It is the employer that must sign (certify) the test record is correct.

Contrary to some advertisement, welder qualification and certifications performed by third party laboratories is not universally transferable from one employer to another unless it is explicitly permitted by the welding code governing the work. Even the AWS structural welding code/steel gives the Owner the prerogative to accept previous qualifications by another employer or third party. Generally, work performed to ASME does not recognize qualification/certification by a previous employer or third party. That being said, there are circumstances and conditions where it is permitted. ASME B31.9 comes to mind. In that case, I believe the current employer is required to obtain a copy of the original test record and the current employer must sign the certifying statement.

The CWI is required to perform the visual inspections of the welds when it is stipulated by the contract. So, while it may not be a code requirement, it may well be a contractual obligation. While the code may not require the visual examination be performed by a CWI, most require the inspector's qualification be documented, reviewed and approved by the Owner (usually through the Engineer representing the Owner).

If you provide more information regarding the applicable code invoked by your contract or specific language included in the project specification, a more explicit response may be offered.

Best regards - Al

 

[ChipFuller]

Thanks for the response and information. We are not contractually obligated because we're doing repair and work on our own equipment and buildings. Our current policy states AWS D17.1 for non flight hardware but for our situation the codes doesn't seem to apply. If I understand AWS D17.1 code correctly, it requires some level of inspection whether it's visual, dye penetrant, mag particle or even X-ray.

In my opinion this is overkill in some circumstances whether a bracket for hose or piece of unistrut is being installed. It seems like there should some level of being reasonable and prudent falls into play. Is there another code that would be more applicable or can the engineer stipulate on the drawings that these are non code welds?

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

 

[dhengr]

ChipFuller:
There aren’t many codes which will tell you that every weld in the world has to be inspected, other than that the welder should be qualified and capable of doing a good weld under the existing conditions and that he be proud enough of his work to self inspect. And then, engineering and engineering judgement and experience come into play too. Is special inspection required in this instance, do you trust your in-plant welders and their abilities? There are all kinds of welds which are twice as good as they need to be. This assumes that your welders aren’t depositing something that looks like globs of chicken sh*t, and that they know enough not to use welding rods which have been laying in water and mud for two weeks before being used.. This is why you have been hired as a plant engineer, to make these types of determinations, to get things done within budget and also to know when a little extra care is required. Over the years, I’ve sometimes told the shop who to use to do a particular weld, when I knew one guy did a better job on this particular type of weld than another guy, but these were not usually just run-of-the-mill shop repair welds.

 

[gtaw]

There are many welding codes and standards to select from. Each welding standard is appropriate for a specific type of work. AWS D17.1 is not appropriate for modifications made to a steel framed building and likewise AWS D1.1 is not appropriate for components fabricated from sheet metal gage materials. It is up to the engineer to determine what code is appropriate for the application. In short, there is some homework and research that needs to be done before determining which welding standard or code is applicable to the work being performed.

Best regards - Al

 

[thaidavid40]

One area where you could run into the need for certified welders, and for weld inspections, is structural repairs or modifications to your building structures (and some non-building structures, like pipe racks). Anywhere the IBC Chapter 17 calls for special inspections - including welding operations - you will need to comply with its provisions.
Dave

Thaidavid

 

[tbuelna]

AWS D17.1 only requires a visual inspection for Non-flight class C structural welds.