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ASTM A252 Grade 3 Welding Process
- Thread starter PEinc
- Start date
1.) A 252 pipe piles can be joined by using E7018 or E71T-X [matching] filler metals (all position electrodes.)
2.) These piles are typically welded in accordance with AWS D1.1 on many projects. The A 252 Gr. 3 pipes are NOT prequalified per D1.1, Table 3.1.
Acceptance criteria for qualification:
D1.1 for piles 1/8" and greater
D1.3 for piles 3/16" and less in thickness
(yes they overlap)
3.) With P being the primary specified alloying element, preheat should be minimal (ambient temp. or 50 degrees F.)
2.) These piles are typically welded in accordance with AWS D1.1 on many projects. The A 252 Gr. 3 pipes are NOT prequalified per D1.1, Table 3.1.
Acceptance criteria for qualification:
D1.1 for piles 1/8" and greater
D1.3 for piles 3/16" and less in thickness
(yes they overlap)
3.) With P being the primary specified alloying element, preheat should be minimal (ambient temp. or 50 degrees F.)
- Thread starter
- #3
CWIC,
Thank you for the quick response. Unfortunately, none of us has AWS D1.1. The pipe piles are 0.365" and 0.500" wall. We had proposed using an AISC B-U4b weld with E7018 electrode. We need some reference which will eliminate the need for a weld testing program. We need to address the non-prequalified issue. Any ideas?
Thank you for the quick response. Unfortunately, none of us has AWS D1.1. The pipe piles are 0.365" and 0.500" wall. We had proposed using an AISC B-U4b weld with E7018 electrode. We need some reference which will eliminate the need for a weld testing program. We need to address the non-prequalified issue. Any ideas?
PE:
While the joint is prequalified (B-U4b) using a single bevel and backgouging, the material itself is not in accordance with the D1.1. I have a letter from the former D1.1 chair stating if a material specification is not listed in Table 3.1, it is not a prequalified material, period. (sorry about the redundancy...)
If you are the EOR, you do have the authority to waive testing in accordance with AWS D1.1:2002, 1.4.1. You will also get to answer for any post-welding related problems or issues if any occur.
While the joint is prequalified (B-U4b) using a single bevel and backgouging, the material itself is not in accordance with the D1.1. I have a letter from the former D1.1 chair stating if a material specification is not listed in Table 3.1, it is not a prequalified material, period. (sorry about the redundancy...)
If you are the EOR, you do have the authority to waive testing in accordance with AWS D1.1:2002, 1.4.1. You will also get to answer for any post-welding related problems or issues if any occur.
One more thought, I would review the welder(s) previous performance qualifications before waiving any mechanical and nondestructive testing.
*When was the last time he/she tested using the SMAW process and F4 group electrodes?
*When was the last time he/she tested in the position used in production?
*When was the last time he/she tested without backing (open root)?
*Does the welder have experience on this type of material?
As a mimimum, I would recommend performing radiography (RT) on the first few production welds to ensure soundness of the welds. At least you will have incorporated some of the required testing specified for WPS qualification. It will also satisfy the performance qualification requirements for the welders (in lieu of bend testing).
*When was the last time he/she tested using the SMAW process and F4 group electrodes?
*When was the last time he/she tested in the position used in production?
*When was the last time he/she tested without backing (open root)?
*Does the welder have experience on this type of material?
As a mimimum, I would recommend performing radiography (RT) on the first few production welds to ensure soundness of the welds. At least you will have incorporated some of the required testing specified for WPS qualification. It will also satisfy the performance qualification requirements for the welders (in lieu of bend testing).
- Thread starter
- #6
1. Any idea on why this material is used for piles, i.e. A252 Grade 2. from what I can see of the amterial it says low carbon steel but from the specs P0.05 and rest Fe. I am confused on whether this is nearly pure Iron or steel.
2. In some technical write up I saw, since this material is not listed in AWS D1.1, they have aswked for this material to be welded considering it an equivalent to A572 Gr 50? Any thoughts on this.
3. If I were looking for a metrial substitute on basis of YS and UTS alone, I can use API 5L Grade B or A36. But is YS and UTS the only things to be considered for the applications that this material intended for namely piles......
An urgent reply would be appreciated.
Thanks and regards
Sayee Prasad R
Ph: 0097143968906
Mob: 00971507682668
email: sayee_prasad@yahoo.com
The black holes of nature are the most perfect macroscopic objects there are in the universe: the only elements in their construction are our concepts of space and time.![[thumbsup]](/data/assets/smilies/thumbsup.gif "[thumbsup] [thumbsup]")
2. In some technical write up I saw, since this material is not listed in AWS D1.1, they have aswked for this material to be welded considering it an equivalent to A572 Gr 50? Any thoughts on this.
3. If I were looking for a metrial substitute on basis of YS and UTS alone, I can use API 5L Grade B or A36. But is YS and UTS the only things to be considered for the applications that this material intended for namely piles......
An urgent reply would be appreciated.
Thanks and regards
Sayee Prasad R
Ph: 0097143968906
Mob: 00971507682668
email: sayee_prasad@yahoo.com
The black holes of nature are the most perfect macroscopic objects there are in the universe: the only elements in their construction are our concepts of space and time.
- Thread starter
- #8
Sayee, I'm not a metalurgy expert but I am under the impression that the A252 steel is more conducive to bending as would be required for coiling steel or for making pipe piles. I believe that the A252 steel also chemically meets A36 and A572. The yield strengths can be different for the various grades of A252 compared to A36 and A572. Get a copy of the A252 requirements.
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