High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
(OP)
Interesting that the glass itself failed, rather than the mounting:
https://abc7news.com/storm-shelter-in-place-order-...
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https://abc7news.com/storm-shelter-in-place-order-...
spsalso
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
That's a myth https://engineering.mit.edu/engage/ask-an-engineer....
Tempered glass is probably even less likely to flow, given the amount of internal stress it has.
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
Given the amount of it, can the internal stress, relax over a period of time?
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So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
As the article indicates, glass is not a "supercooled fluid", but an amorphous solid, i.e., it has no general or pervasive crystalline structure, but has, relatively small domains of crystallinity. The bottom line is that glass, tempered or otherwise, basically doesn't change, on the order of centuries, if not millenia. It's no different than, say, Damascus steel, in retaining its mechanical properties. It's by far more robust than Teflon, which actually does flow under pressure.
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
The safety glass you could throw bowling balls, hammers what you like at it in the scrap skip and they would just bounce out. If you wanted to break it to get more in the skip you just tapped the edge with a toffee hammer and the whole lot would go.
Its something to do with the result of the tempering process.
Glass does change over time, normal glass pre tempering you have about 1-2 years after manufacturing to cut it or form it. After that it gets much more brittle and unworkable in a cold state. If its been processed/treated it is of course unworkable.
A can't give a reference to it, its just experience.
Oh there is a rod of glass in either the science museum or one of the UK classical university's which is suspended horizontally between 2 supports which has a bit of a visual sag in the middle. Its 300-400 years old and the sag is mm over a 3ft length.
We had a lecture on glass in materials, from memory the modern stuff is completely different to the pre WW2 stuff which quite a lot of it is in modern standards higher than acceptable radioactive.
And to note there are glass instruments of the same era as the rod and there is no noticeable or measurable changes and they include optical glassware.
Not that it will be a factor in this case.
I suspect the window has flexed in its mount and moved over the years to get the edge into contact with something, maybe a screw head not put in flush, hard enough to trigger the self destruction mode of a side tap to the edge.
Glass is amazing stuff. We only got 1 lecture on it and the summary was its doesn't work the way you think it should, but its amazing stuff.
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
https://www.pilkington.com/en-gb/uk/architects/gla...
https://www.southampton.ac.uk/engineering/research...
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
John R. Baker, P.E. (ret)
Irvine, CA
Siemens PLM:
The secret of life is not finding someone to live with
It's finding someone you can't live without
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
UK though did change things after the PIRA bombing in London which basically blew out all the windows in the area.
I am no expert but if its big shards then it just annealed plain glass not tempered I think.
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
https://www.builderspace.com/what-kind-of-glass-is...
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
They press the front on which pushes back a safety interlock and they can release the spring.
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
John R. Baker, P.E. (ret)
Irvine, CA
Siemens PLM:
The secret of life is not finding someone to live with
It's finding someone you can't live without
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
The old untreated glass does change, the reason I really don't know. I just know don't even attempt to cut it for a cheap fix for someone's green house. It just splits in funny directions never along the line.
They have loads of sheets of it around me of unknown age. I won't go near it. But you can see people sitting next to piles of broken glass trying to turn it into something. They spend 2-3 days messing around with it, when for 20 euro they could just email the local DIY shop with the sizes and pick it up the next day. And if you need to trim it then you can do. If the heavens align and you manage a straight cut with the old stuff and try and touch it again I have never yet seen it work.
You might wonder why I get involved in glazing. Basically its the kids playing and when something gets broken I really can't be bothered by the week of finger pointing and kangaroo courts trying to find out what happened. So I just get the size email the DIY shop stick the tools in the car pick it up and fit it without getting involved. And strangely there seems to be other fathers in the area that have learned this behaviour cuts out the ear ache and do it as well now. Seems to annoy some though as it removes the entertainment of a community kangaroo court.
So I can see windows lasting years through more severe weather then all of a sudden them breaking for apparently little reason if its cheap untreated glass.
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
The problems are not isolated to Trump's tower.
https://www.ktvu.com/news/broken-glass-in-san-fran...
I believe there was at least one other highrise that lost panes.
The winds weren't that high, is it common for buildings in hurricane country to lose panes in 50-60mph winds? Maybe this is a government problem to have such a cluster of failures.
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
https://www.wlrn.org/news/2015-10-26/windows-lost-...
This winter has been quite something around here (SF Bay Area).
On the plus side, our California water resource people have been building many reservoirs over the last years, and all that extra water has been caught and stored for later drought. OOPS! No, sorry. That's an alternate reality.
Speaking of alternate reality: how about instead of the High Speed Train to Nowhere, that money had been spent on reservoirs? In THIS reality. Or maybe even (more) desalination.
spsalso
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
That's easy, just monetize the water. Water rates are currently in the pennies per gallon range; amp that up to, say, $0.25/gal and people will stop using as much water, and there'll be more people interested in saving every drop of rainwater. If your water bill were $800/month, I think you'd even be interested lobbying anyone you can find to build more reservoirs and perhaps even build cisterns and roof-top/backyard rain catchers.
It's only about $10B, so the other choice is to raise taxes, either directly, or for the interest on the bonds required.
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
Al frames are a pain. And colossally thermally ineffective.
My max wind speed though is only 25 m/s
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
spsalso
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
OK, so pay your extra taxes for the $10B
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
But without them, all that water that just went out into the ocean isn't going to be available for the next drought.
I would rather have built reservoirs than a high speed passenger line that whisks people from Merced to Fresno at a breakneck speed. At no small cost. When it's finally done.
spsalso
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
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RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
Well, if I can jack up the water prices like you're advocating ("...say, $0.25/gal..."), it DOES look like a really good investment (building new reservoirs).
What slows my admittedly un-financed enthusiasm is the thought that the Great State of California would decide I was being very bad, and "stat-ilize" my investment. I could be in error in predicting the actions of government entities, of course.
spsalso
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm
https://missionlocal.org/2023/04/broken-windows-th...
spsalso
RE: High rise window fail in San Francisco storm