Help related fight data recorder
Help related fight data recorder
(OP)
I have a few questions related to the Flight Data recorder . As I see here is all about helping each other . I would like to get your advice.
As I have been working on a project related to the flight data recorder, I would like to know if you could help me get some detailed information about
this, for example, how the FDR works (not general information which is on Wikipedia and all , I want detailed information, for example, how
it processes the data), how and what types of blocks are used. For example, several printed circuit boards are used, how and why they are
used, what interface is used, how is the circuitry designed , what type of electronic elements are used and how they work , design of the
FDR , how the integrated circuit is built , the design of the FDR , etc. etc. I think you'll get an idea of what type of information I need, because I want to do my specialist in the department and study of the FDR, so I need to know, and I thought that an engineer or technical expert or anyone who can help me and share knowledge will be really helpful.
As I have been working on a project related to the flight data recorder, I would like to know if you could help me get some detailed information about
this, for example, how the FDR works (not general information which is on Wikipedia and all , I want detailed information, for example, how
it processes the data), how and what types of blocks are used. For example, several printed circuit boards are used, how and why they are
used, what interface is used, how is the circuitry designed , what type of electronic elements are used and how they work , design of the
FDR , how the integrated circuit is built , the design of the FDR , etc. etc. I think you'll get an idea of what type of information I need, because I want to do my specialist in the department and study of the FDR, so I need to know, and I thought that an engineer or technical expert or anyone who can help me and share knowledge will be really helpful.
RE: Help related fight data recorder
This appears to be the latest interface standard: https://www.aviation-ia.com/products/717-15-flight...
RE: Help related fight data recorder
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
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RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
Be sure You have access to...
AC20-141 AIRWORTHINESS AND OPERATIONAL APPROVAL OF DIGITAL FLIGHT DATA RECORDER SYSTEMS
FAA TSO-C124 FLIGHT DATA RECORDER SYSTEMS
ARINC 747 FLIGHT DATA RECORDER (FDR)
[NTSB] FDR [FLIGHT DATA RECORDER] HANDBOOK
MIL-HDBK-2124 FLIGHT DATA RECORDER FUNCTIONAL STANDARDS FOR
Regards, Wil Taylor
o Trust - But Verify!
o We believe to be true what we prefer to be true. [Unknown]
o For those who believe, no proof is required; for those who cannot believe, no proof is possible. [variation,Stuart Chase]
o Unfortunately, in science what You 'believe' is irrelevant. ["Orion", Homebuiltairplanes.com forum]
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
https://aviation.stackexchange.com/questions/57375...
https://www.bea.aero/uploads/tx_scalaetudessecurit...
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
Hmmmmmmm… there are no short-cuts to this process... other than proprietary design manuals/data.
NOTE.
I, have assumed that we are discussing crashworthy FDRs... not FDRs intended for routine systems/components health/diagnostics monitoring and maintenance use. That is simply an avionics-rack black box for data storage and scheduled down-load to a mainframe computer.
Crashworthy FDR and CVR elements appear to be 'relatively straight forward' cousin of the 'FDRs for maintenance'... data-in, compact/storage, etc... EXCEPT that crash/post-crash survival and data-retrieval are the ass-kickers. The environmental criteria for crash/post-crash survival are mind-numbing: high speed impact... crushing ocean depths... long-duration fire... etc... are corner-of-the-envelop design mandates for [CVR/FDR] data survival/retrieval.
To design crash worthy FDRs You must understand all aspects that can be derived from printed sources. THEN: design, build, test... iterate... design build test... iterate... etc.
About now is where I insert a few quotes about experience...
Learning from experience is a faculty almost never practiced." --Barbara Tuchman, historian and writer
Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn." --C.S. Lewis
Experience is what you get when you didn't get what you wanted. And experience is often the most valuable thing you have to offer.” --Randy Pausch
Experience is never limited, and it is never complete.” --Henry James, writer
It is necessary for us to learn from others' mistakes. You will not live long enough to make them all yourself." -- Hyman Rickover, American admiral
Regards, Wil Taylor
o Trust - But Verify!
o We believe to be true what we prefer to be true. [Unknown]
o For those who believe, no proof is required; for those who cannot believe, no proof is possible. [variation,Stuart Chase]
o Unfortunately, in science what You 'believe' is irrelevant. ["Orion", Homebuiltairplanes.com forum]
RE: Help related fight data recorder
I suggest the following:
> https://www.curtisswrightds.com/infocenter/white-p... -- they have several white papers on FDRs
> https://www.google.com/search?q=flight+data+record...
> https://www.freepatentsonline.com/result.html?sort... -- obviously, researching prior art is the first step to a new design
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
As a machine it is very simple, it records data and makes the data available for upload. It doesn't AFAIK manipulate the data.
I doubt anyone is going to tell you know to make an FDR. We here don't know the details (or if we do we're not responding). You may get some better response from a manufacturer of the FDR (I doubt the airplane manufacturers will/can tell you much … to them it's just a piece of equipment). I'd suggest getting your hands on a scrapped FDR and opening it !
Have you tried Google or YouTube ? (a google for "flight data recorder design" yielded some promising links)
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
Well blow me down, companies don't give away their designs and intellectual property to an unknown person who just asks for it. Shock horror
You might therefore have just chosen the wrong subject to study....
Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.
RE: Help related fight data recorder
You may take a trip to the patent office, but I suspect these aren't patented (as that means showing everyone what you're doing).
I suspect the trick is making the data survive fire and water (and whatever else).
And, no, it looks like we can't (aren't) going to be able to help you further.
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.
RE: Help related fight data recorder
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
Not useful in an FDR, there have been fraudulent USB sticks that misreport actual data capacity. Some are smart enough to detect probes from anti-virus software and hide files that contain a virus.
In an FDR it would be useful for a logical controller to write data in parallel for data error detection to multiple flash controllers.
There are hobby FDRs for R/C airplanes and rocketry, but anyone asking for a beginner course is a year or more in learning programming and electronics debugging before building a useful one.
RE: Help related fight data recorder
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
Regards, Wil Taylor
o Trust - But Verify!
o We believe to be true what we prefer to be true. [Unknown]
o For those who believe, no proof is required; for those who cannot believe, no proof is possible. [variation,Stuart Chase]
o Unfortunately, in science what You 'believe' is irrelevant. ["Orion", Homebuiltairplanes.com forum]
RE: Help related fight data recorder
then it should tell you what you have to design to … loads, temps, times, etc.
of course, it won't tell How to design it ! But it is a typical certification standard.
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
Are you all... I dunno... ...bored?
Why entertain this discussion when all of you know it's pointless and all of you know the OP is clueless?
Typing at 30 words per minute have you all collectively blown 1 hour on this thread?
www.sparweb.ca
RE: Help related fight data recorder
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
what's the matter steve, you don't like windmills ?
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
www.sparweb.ca
RE: Help related fight data recorder
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
New members with opening questions... like this one... can lead to interesting/unique discussions amongst ourselves... and light a fire under the newcomers who are truly interested/motivated to learn... or smoke-out the 1-timers who are amateurs/frauds/phishers.
I discovered... painfully... a long time ago that amateurs/frauds/phishers expose themselves by the content of their discussions... and/or 'topic-ignorance'... IE: obvious inexperience not interested in true-learning... and/or presenting a narrow/channeled focus that RARELY/NEVER crosses similar-to boundaries... and/or verbiage that may/may-not have a 'ring-tone' of authenticity... and/or may/may-not suggest/imply something illegal.
In the case of lord8055, my antenna are 'up' and I [we?] have suspicions RE background/motivation... although [lord8055 if listening] I sometimes have to be reminded by my wife to 'have patience and tolerance' for youth and inexperience.
BUT... again... this is an interesting and mostly unexplored topic-area... and I've actually 'learned something new' from some of the replies!
Regards, Wil Taylor
o Trust - But Verify!
o We believe to be true what we prefer to be true. [Unknown]
o For those who believe, no proof is required; for those who cannot believe, no proof is possible. [variation,Stuart Chase]
o Unfortunately, in science what You 'believe' is irrelevant. ["Orion", Homebuiltairplanes.com forum]
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
knowledge needs to be acquired and so I can also study and develop my knowledge on those extra fields which can help me in my professional
work life.
RE: Help related fight data recorder
you mentioned earlier that you wanted toe design/build an FDR. Why not buy a scrapped one and take it apart ?
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
https://www.aeroexpo.online/aeronautic-manufacture...
Talk to these guys.
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
out of interest, what attracts you to this specific piece of equipment ? I doubt that there are people who only design FDRs.
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm
RE: Help related fight data recorder
Yes, I know there are specific design conditions to be met, I still doubt that there's a guy whose (only) job is to design FDRs. I suspect that it is considered "just" another piece of equipment, to be updated as time goes by.
Note too, there is a move to replace the FDR with ground stored data, systems I've seen called Inflight Safety Management Systems which send the FDR data over satellite comms to the home maintenance base, so the data is not lost. But so far I haven't heard of CVR data being stored "off-ship" ... union issues or pilot privacy issues I suspect.
another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?
RE: Help related fight data recorder
RE: Help related fight data recorder