Contact US

Log In

Come Join Us!

Are you an
Engineering professional?
Join Eng-Tips Forums!
  • Talk With Other Members
  • Be Notified Of Responses
    To Your Posts
  • Keyword Search
  • One-Click Access To Your
    Favorite Forums
  • Automated Signatures
    On Your Posts
  • Best Of All, It's Free!

*Eng-Tips's functionality depends on members receiving e-mail. By joining you are opting in to receive e-mail.

Posting Guidelines

Promoting, selling, recruiting, coursework and thesis posting is forbidden.

Students Click Here

Justification for data historian?

Justification for data historian?

Justification for data historian?

What is the justification for a data historian in, or connected through OPC, a DCS or PLC system?  

Application of the control system is control of a small chemical plant ~3000 I/O.

This is normally the space where people post something insightful.

RE: Justification for data historian?

The data permits analysis of the causes of an upset or a trip.  Perhaps long term data collection could prove useful if a state or federal agency asks about your emissions, releases, accidents or other operating issues on July 21, 2007.

RE: Justification for data historian?

Intermittents, and previously undiscovered errors, would be my justification, with the latter being more critical.  

Often, you'll find a "new" problem, but careful review of past data will show that the problem existed for a long time, but was only now actually "discovered."  

The historical data might then show the conditions what result in the "new" problem, and save you months of investigation.


FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies

RE: Justification for data historian?

The trend and event recording capabilities of a good Historian are invaluable when trying to investigate a complex event such as a process upset with no obvious cause. They are useful to provide evidence supporting things like warranty claims, performance tests, and the like. A well configured Historian removes a lot of speculation and guesswork, and can be a good tool for keeping an eye on how well operational staff are performing. They soon realise that the computer just records what happens impartially so things like shift logs become more accurate!

If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!

RE: Justification for data historian?

I work with a bunch of process engineers, they seem to love crunching historical data in Excel. I suspect the Data Historian is better at saving in that format.

RE: Justification for data historian?

downside is, you have a smoking gun.  Make sure you have a written proceedure for getting rid of old data.

RE: Justification for data historian?

Also they often create a tremendous pile of data to warehouse.

Keith Cress
kcress - http://www.flaminsystems.com

RE: Justification for data historian?

The data can be used for modeling systems and tuning PIDs.  

RE: Justification for data historian?

This strip chart recorder ad from the '40's is just as  valid today as ot was then:


RE: Justification for data historian?

That must be the grandfather of the ones I work with!

If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!

RE: Justification for data historian?

What's a strip chart recorder?

Oh - I remember that's one of those things we bought years ago for chewing up paper isn't it?


RE: Justification for data historian?

As I recall, Brown became Minneapolis Honeywell.  There were lots of Brown recorders, especially multi-point temperature recorders in the old refineries when I was a pup.

In the early '80's we put data loggers in plants that had two paper boxes.  One would feed the printer, the second to collect the printed paper.  Nobody at the plant evaluated any of the data - only moved the paper to storage.  I used the records to determine the time between a field gathering compressor trip and the plant inlet pressure falling to the low pressure alarm point, etc.

RE: Justification for data historian?

I'll tack on to JLS's post.  Even with a data historian I make the operators keep some paper logs just they do not sit around.  Their are always sites and sounds that real senses can detect.  Just a quirk.  

I also like paper chart back ups on sales meters, the lastrst flow computers fail and a paper chart comes in handy when there are $100,000,000 at stake.

Red Flag This Post

Please let us know here why this post is inappropriate. Reasons such as off-topic, duplicates, flames, illegal, vulgar, or students posting their homework.

Red Flag Submitted

Thank you for helping keep Eng-Tips Forums free from inappropriate posts.
The Eng-Tips staff will check this out and take appropriate action.

Reply To This Thread

Posting in the Eng-Tips forums is a member-only feature.

Click Here to join Eng-Tips and talk with other members! Already a Member? Login


Close Box

Join Eng-Tips® Today!

Join your peers on the Internet's largest technical engineering professional community.
It's easy to join and it's free.

Here's Why Members Love Eng-Tips Forums:

Register now while it's still free!

Already a member? Close this window and log in.

Join Us             Close