What's important on a resume¦... 1

[edsongebo]

Most folks use the 'fudge' factor when writing their resume. Some don't and probably should. When is too much 'fudging' going to get you in trouble? If you’re in a position to review resume´s what are you looking for to help narrow down candidates? How do you decipher between “lies” and “factual”? Did you ever kick a resume´ to the curb only to find out that was ‘the guy’ you needed to hire? Let’s hear your experiences.

Edson-

 

[edsongebo]

I disagree with a photo of any kind in a resume. However, I carry a portfolio of the more important 3D models I have created and/or designed. This portfolio also makes for great conversation for those who are interested to look thru it and want to ask questions. I'm also proud to have it with me for it's a glowing example of where I came from and what I desire to be

Edson-

 

[MikeHalloran]

My current resume is five pages, and includes color photographs of five things I've done:

* The engineroom of a superyacht, showing parts of the exhaust system I designed, assembled, and tested.
* An exhaust riser under test on the flow bench, with water spraying where it should.
* A photo of a printed color rendering of a 3D object done in AutoCAD 3D, underneath the actual object, with a machinists scale.
* A timing belt pulley with a sliding- block coupling squeezed inside, built to keep belt tension from interfering with a wrap spring clutch.
* A flight simular for which I engineered the structure.

Everyone is asking for Word doc files these days, so why not include (low res) photos. The file is ~100k bytes.

The top half of the first page grabs the reader by the throat with a couple of actual quotes that don't quite approach "walks on water". They're attributed to an anonymous title. I haven't decided whether to give the person's name, too.

The text for the more recent jobs makes it clear, if not explicit, why I don't work there anymore. I've had a lot of jobs, and some of them didn't end well. Attempting to candy- coat something like that makes you seem evasive; much better to tell the truth. Excising the vitriol from text like that is very, very hard.

I've tried cutting it down to a page or two, but in my case, the 'good stuff' is spread out over decades, and several tens of jobs, so I couldn't just truncate it.


It's getting a better response rate than any that have gone before it, including unsolicited praise from retained recruiters apologizing that they wish they had an opening for me.

The photos greatly increased the response rate.

So did removing the word 'honest'. I was disappointed by that.



Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[Electic]

Another perspective. If you 'sell' yourself into a position you don't really fit, will you be happy there for the long term?

A good resume should leave open your potential but not compell unnatural things to happen.

I personally prefer very short resumes that only list the benefits rendered, of previous work experience, and what the assignment was. I will flesh out the details in interview.

I've seen way too many resumes where in the person listed 300 projects that each would take 3 years. Upon questioning, it was apparent they played a bit role in such projects.

 

[MikeHalloran]

That short resume is the perfect thing to personally deliver to the decision maker, or the Chairman, or your hometown newspaper.

If you're forced to go through HR, or recruiters, or one of those horrid automated resume parsers, it won't be very effective. At least, mine wasn't.








Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[HgTX]

"A good resume should leave open your potential but not compell unnatural things to happen."

"Potential" and "experience" are two different things, and all the resume is supposed to list is experience. So if you put down stuff that you have touched on and anticipate being able to get good at, is that "leaving open potential", or is that fudging?

Hg

Eng-Tips policies: faq731-376

 

[sms]

I think a two page resume is fine. I have been using a two page format for 20 years, and it has landed me plenty of interviews.

-The future's so bright I gotta wear shades!

 

[MikeHalloran]

Short resumes worked for me for the first 20 years.

For the second 20 years, not so much.





Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[rbulsara]

I would think after 20 years, one would not need a resume longer than half a page!

If someone is not impressed with me spending 20 years in a certain field, I would not want to work for him/her.

 

[Ron]

DO NOT FUDGE! I am proud of my experience in my years as an engineer and everything on my resume is verifiable.

In general I see two types of resumes....the "I'm looking for a job" resume, and the "my company is looking for a project", resume. The former is one that should contain essentially everything you've done in your career (succinctly, though) and the latter should be tailored with project specific experience.

Remember...a resume says more than the words accumulated on paper. It should be neat, well organized, and logically presented. You don't have to follow one of the "resume" formats, but do keep the info in a logical order. The order I use is:

Education and Qualifications/Licensure
Professional Memberships/Activities
Experience ( in a narrative form, not just date-to-date bullets)
Accolades
Personal (this is always optional)

I will dismiss a resume that contains poor sentence structure, poor grammar, typographical errors, or poor spelling in either the resume or the cover letter.

 

[IRstuff]

I've run across multipage resumes, and haven't yet seen anything to strongly recommend their usage. In one case, it was from a person without a BS and his lengthy work history simply pointed out a LOT of job hopping, all with allegedly good reasons...

Keep it simple, keep it truthful. I don't have quarrel with "experience with" or "familiar with" when it applies to specific programs. I usually ask what that specific experience is and most people seem to respond with truthful answers.

TTFN

 

[Ashereng]

I have read (from Fortune Magazine) that some Fortune 500 companies do not read cover letters - takes too long. Oh well.

In my own case, it depends on how big the stack of resume is on my desk. If I have a stack of 20 resumes, I pretty much read everything (basis of 3 page per resume, and the cover letter). If I have a stack of 200 resume (co-op/intern hiring), I skim really really fast (figure it out for yourself what you would look at). What do I skim for? Well, firstly, marks. Secondly, the names of my competitor (if they were good enough for my competitor, then they are probably good enough for me). Third, anything that stands out from what I typically see in a resume.


For someone with experience:
With regards to a resume, it is supposed to list what you have done. If you have done the same type of work at 20 companies over 15 years, it is still pretty much a one line item.

If you can't describe what you do in one page, in my mind, that means you don't really know what you do.

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
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[MadMango]

Ashereng is making a great point. If I have a small stack, I'll read everything carefully, but if I have a large pile (20+) I'll skim as well. I look at previous companies, and time employed. If I see someone that is jumping jobs every 6-9 months, I won't consider them.

I know our resumes are screened by HR before they ever make it down to me. HR does not read the cover letter, but reviews for skills and education, objective data that they can compare to listed job requirements. What they do poorly is scan for the type of work a candidate has been involved with. We may be looking for someone that is very hands-on vs someone that strictly crunches numbers. HR can't tell the difference even when we tell them what to look for. I always wonder who we have passed-up due to HR's screening attemps.

[green]"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."[/green]

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[HgTX]

"With regards to a resume, it is supposed to list what you have done. If you have done the same type of work at 20 companies over 15 years, it is still pretty much a one line item."

That's only true if you're doing a skills-based resume rather than a history-based resume. There are still plenty of people out there, unfortunately, who think if someone's providing a skills-based resume then they must be trying to hide something about their job history.

Hg

Eng-Tips policies: faq731-376

 

[whyun]

By definition, resume is a summary or an overview of one's qualifications. Be as brief as possible but make each words count.

 

[edsongebo]

from MadMango:

"HR can't tell the difference even when we tell them what to look for. I always wonder who we have passed-up due to HR's screening attempts..."

A possible answer to MadMango's statement...

"Ask your competitors!"

 

[waskillywabbit]

If you have to lie on your resume, you're not qualified to apply for the job.

Brian

 

[GregLocock]

Oh, rubbish. My 25 year sentence for an axe murder doesn't make me unqualified for an engineering job, but I wouldn't put it on my resume.

Cheers

Greg Locock

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[Ashereng]

Greg,

In my jurisdiction, and indictable offense automatically disqualifies you from holding a P. Eng. In otherwords, it does make you unqualified to hold an "engineering" position since you are no longer an engineer.



"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[GregLocock]

What, even if the sentence was served? Seems harsh. I thought the idea was that by completing the sentence you had 'paid your debt to society', but I am no legal expert.

Just in case anyone is wondering that was a ridiculous example, to make a serious point. There are certain things that will prevent your resume getting past HR that should not, but will, disqualify you from an engineer's job.

And needless to say in your jurisdiction, in your part of the industry, I am not an "engineer" anyway. It's no skin off my nose, the bills get paid just the same.

Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[DRC1]

A resume is a ONE PAGE explination of what you have to offer my firm. Why you will fit in well at my firm is the topic of the cover letter. I do not blantently belive every adjetive that is written, but if it starts to sound like a realestate add, your losing me. Spelling and apperance, including paper quality, are important.If your resume is not worth all your effort, what will you put effort into? In reading the resume, I look at how long you have worked at each firm. If you have moved from division to division with in a firm be clear about it. I have seen many resumes where this is the case but with out reading carefully, it lookslike the person was workig for different firms every few years. I then look not so much what the person was resbonsible for, as this gets distorted and really does not matter. I look at what tasks the person has performed. If I am looking for a design engineer, I prefer someone who has experience designing, instead of only supervising designers. Tell me what skills you have, not what the people you supervised had.
Finally I look to see the word "work", especially in the sentence that describes what type of employment the applicant is seeking.Most say "I would like a postion that will allow my to challenge my full engineering potential" Thats not why I will hire you. I prefer" I would like to work as a structral engineer and have the oppertunity to learn to design complex structures." That will get you a interview with a positive mind set. If you show me in a personalized cover letter that you have a familiarity with my firm thats even better.