BA has been talking about classical Saint-Venant torsion; this assumes that the angle of twist is small, the elastic limits of the material are not exceeded, and that the shape of the cross section does not change. The section just rolls (rotates), but retains it shape, and this is generally true for most WF shapes, or distortions in shape are so small they can be neglected, thus the web stiffeners we are talking about will not appreciably improve the torsional capacity of these beams. If some of the member components are thin or tall and slender, such as some webs, plate girders, the shape of the cross section is likely to distort due to the warping torsional moment, just as SAIL3 suggests. This is called the ‘Goodier-Barton effect’ of web distortion, and in some shapes and cases might have to be considered. (See J.N. Goodier and M.V. Barton, “The Effects of Web Deformation on the Torsion of I-Beams,” Journal of Appl. Mechanics, 11, MAR1944).
St. Venant torsion assumes that the cross section shape doesn’t change, but is free to warp, this is a uniform or pure torsion, represented by St.Venant’s soap film analogy. But, since most members are not free to warp under torsion, normal stresses exist or are induced, particularly in the flanges, due to the bending of the flanges. Thus, both St. Venant (shear stresses) and warping torsional stresses (normal & shear stresses) occur together in the member. In addition, there will be the regular normal and shear stresses in the member due to bending as a beam, gravity loaded, about its shear center. All of these stresses must be combined, in appropriate fashion, to start to approach the output of a FEA. And, on a problem like this the FEA is incredibly sensitive to the way the model is put together; the types of elements used, the boundary conditions, the types of constraints employed, etc. etc. You certainly better know the limitations and idiosyncrasies of the program you are using. And, it may be quite edifying to run the same problem with several different programs, as Ishvaaag has, to start to understand what these infallible programs are doing to our thinking and understanding. You want to model this problem with small solid elements, but can’t afford to; but to model it as a beam or smaller plate elements may be missing half the detail at the important locations.
I pretty much agree with BA and 271828 that these type web stiffeners shouldn’t do much to improve the torsional strength of the WF shape, except preventing the shape from distorting in the immediate area of the stiffener. And, given Ishvaaag’s FEA they may actually cause some high, but quite localized stress points, if not detailed very carefully. I would have to see much more detail on the FEA input and output and the way it was modeled, the actual stress output, etc. I assume Ishvaaag’s model didn’t show the stiffeners clipped at the radius btwn. the web and flg. and I’ll bet that is one of the places where the max. stresses occur, as a triaxial stress condition no less. The fixity at the end reactions is suspect for high stresses too.
Some of my thoughts, or food for thought, RE: Ishvaaag’s models and results:
1. The first model with the 1.9 tonne point load applied at the center of the beam and out at the tip of the flgs.: I have two questions; are there two point loads, one at each flg. tip, one on each side of the beam, the near side, up, on the top flg. and the far side, down, on the bottom flg.; thus the torsional moment would be (1.9)(300mm)? I’m having trouble with the orientation of the load and the distorted shape of the beam, on the third page, his 24JUL11, 13:48 post, seem bass-ackwards; the visible load should be pointing upward for the distortion shown. This is actually a pretty complex problem from the Theory of Elasticity standpoint, and we should remember Saint-Venant’s principle as relates to stress conditions and our simplified methods near point loads and reactions, but there aren’t any structural detail anomalies which would cause a high von Mises stress, except at the application of the loads and the reaction points at the ends. Funny enough, Saint-Venant is also associated with BA’s soap film analogy for representing torsional shear stress. The point loads cause canti. plate type bending in the vert. direction in the flgs., but torsionally cause the flg. to bend in its strong direction in the plane of the flg. This latter bending, or the torsional shear forces associated with it, is what causes the WF section rotation, but this torsional loading is distributed over some considerable length of the WF, about the beam center, in inputting the total torsional moment. I suspect the von Mises stress and the Max. Principal stress will exist in the area of the flg. tips or flg./web connection near the load application, or at the end reaction plates and beam flg. tips.
2. In the second example with the 15mm thick stiffeners at 500mm o/c, one pair of stiffeners is at the center of the beam, right at the load application, and that torsional moment is input to the whole WF right there at length/2 from the reactions, not over some beam length, thus the rotational angle and displacements will be significantly greater in this case. I think this is about what Ishvaaag is trying to say in his 24JUL11, 18:26 post, but I think the results have more to do with the abrupt input of the torsional moment to the whole WF section at a max. distance from the reactions, thus a max. rotational angle, rather than any great change in the flg. lateral bending.
3. The third and forth examples, a distributed torsional loading over the full length of the beam, and on only one side is an apples vs. oranges comparison to the first two examples. Quite a different loading condition and a much larger total load on the beam. Despite the larger total load, it might well cause relatively smaller deformations and stresses per unit of loading given the way it is applied, and when applied over the full length of the beam. In the first two cases the moment is applied at the center of the beam, and has the full half length in which to induce the angle of rotation; in case 1 gradually through flg. bending, and in case 2 harshly and abruptly through two stiffeners. In cases 3 & 4 the distributed load induces less regular beam bending and also less rotation per unit of load since part of the load is nearer the reactions.
I am always floored by the fact that when all else fails in our ability at comprehension, we go to FEA for the ultimate solution. But, then are unable to explain how that actually works, how it should be modeled, or what the results mean, and we sight a von Mises stress and a Max. Principal stress, but can’t see where they are, the volume over which they act, or their orientation, and we take them as gospel. Not giving much of a second thought to the fact that they might be (probably are) caused by the way the structure was modeled at a few nodes or at one boundary or point of intersection of two or three plane elements. And, we can’t seem to square the FEA results with our gut feelings, or the simplified solutions which we were taught years ago and which seemed to have work without disaster for so many years. I’m all for seeing your (more exact?) solution, but not when it doesn’t square with what I know has worked for years. I expect FEA to refine my detailed solutions and assist me in refining my gross analysis, not to reinvent the Theory of Elasticity. Ishvaaag may be doing us a service here by forcing us to consider that the first FEA solution may not be better, or more correcter, than our gut feeling, our simplified solution, and we better think twice about taking all FEA results for the gospel. Thanks for the effort Ishvaaag.