Structural Steel Shop Drawings

[cb1331]

Hello all.

I am just wondering what the typical shop drawing review process' are in your firms. We typically request that structural steel shop drawings (both fabrication and erection) be sealed by a Professional Engineer. I am wondering if this is out of the norm when compared to other firms. Is this a bit stringent or no? I see how it certainly relieves the consulting engineer of problems down the road but also drives up the cost for the steel supplier/fabricator.

Your thoughts on this are appreciated.

 

[Lion06]

We only require any calcs to be signed and sealed, not the shop drawings. I don't see where that is relieving any liability, it's still your design whether they seal the shops or not.

 

[OHIOMatt]

Shop drawings or calculations only need to be signed and sealed if there is a delegated portion of the design such as conections.

If the design is complete with no delegation, no signing and sealing is required.

 

[kelowna]

I would be interested on hearing the opinion of other engineers. In my experience signing and sealing shop drawings is a practice that varies from area to area and from industry to industry. Some companies do it, others not. Some engineering companies require it, other do not.

In fact a particular subcontractor refused to sign them because they would go against the code of ethics of his province. The logic being that the shop drawings did not have an 'engineering act' (they were simple and basically cut and paste from design drawings) and signing them would imply that he performed an engineering act. On consultations with the regulatory body, they agreed with him.

 

[AAAprince]

I believe that it varies from place to place. The eng. stamp would be for general compliance of the contract. I would recommend to check the guidelines in your province.

 

[archeng59]

We require the connections not detailed on the drawings to be designed by a licensed structural engineer and that sealed and signed calculations for the connections be made available upon request. Same thing for bar joist shops. I do not require the shops to be sealed for steel framing and connections that I designed. I design all my connections but my partner does not, so our office policy is to have calcs available if requested. I require shops for metal buildings to be sealed and signed by the structural PE working for the metal building fabricator. Same for precast concrete components.

 

[connectegr]

We provide sealed calculations and shop drawings for industrial and commercial projects in the US and Canada. The requirements vary, but typically sealed calculations are required for all connection designs provided. But, for many projects sealed shop drawings are required, which requires that we review the drawings for conformance to the connection designs provided. An additional note is provided stating the our review and seal is for adequacy of connections only. Several of our fabricator customers, also request that we review the drawings as an additional quality control. I know several engineers that require this review and seal, simply to avoid receiving un-checked or incomplete drawings for initial submittal. Ideally we review checked shop drawings simultaneous to the EOR review. The detailer incorporates our comments and the EOR comments at the same time, and we seal the "for fabrication" drawings.

IMHO the intent of requiring a connection engineer is based primarily on the need for the additional review of shop drawings. A second professional review, with a primary focus on the connection details. The expectation is that this additional review will catch changes made intentionally or accidentally by the detailer/fabricator. (Hyatt collapse)

http://www.FerrellEngineering.com

 

[csd72]

I would think that as the building designer you have a duty of care to ensure that the design intentions are met. I am not sure how that could be done by another engineer.

There is also the possibility that you as the designer have made an error and this is another step where it might be picked up.

 

[Ron]

I do delegated engineering work for a couple of specialty fabricators. All of my calculations are signed and sealed; however, I do not always sign and seal the shop drawings. If requested by the engineer of record, I will review, sign and seal the drawings (as long as I have input and can change at will!)

 

[Ron]

Regarding the question of liability...

Yes, delegated engineering work can help the liability position of the engineer of record. Not necessarily directly, but at the least the EOR's specific reliance on the delegate engineer would allow the EOR a potential for subrogation against the delegate engineer, in the event of a valid claim.