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replace a vt-100 with a newer monitor/keyboard
- Thread starter BobM3
- Start date
"vt-100 emulation" in Google gives about 100K hits.
Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-
Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-
Hiya-
Please note that the windows (at least 98 and earlier)
terminal program says to 'nix boxes that it's a "vt-100"
type terminal, yet does a rather poor job of doing
cursor manipulation, so you might get some rather strange
output. I "think" that it's still bad on XP, I just don't
remember offhand.
I *STILL* use windoze "telnet" to 'nix boxen, and I just
live with the rather poor job of it doing "vi". Sigh.
(control L is your friend).
Seriously, if you are having problems with your windoze
terminal program talking to your robot, try a live CD
version of linux and "minicom" and see if there is a
happier interface. I would use knoppix, but that is just
personal opinion. The 'nix systems have typically supported
a DEC (Digital Equipment Corp.) VT-100 terminal much
more faithfully as a terminal emulator.
If there is no connection at all, i.e. no characters
coming/going from the interface, you might need a
"null modem". This device interchanges pins 2 and 3
(transmit data and receive data) on a serial interface.
They are available in both DB9 and DB25 versions.
Also, the robot might need some EIA conditioning signals.
Failing the null modem, You might have to put TWO
null modems together.
Usually the null modems wrap DTR/DSR CTS/RTS/DCD together
to fool the DTE that the "modem" is happy and connected.
These are high level one signals. In other words a high
is a logic one.
Then we have to use the terminal program to figure out the
baud rate, number of data bits and parity. Those are all
usually configurable from the desired terminal emulation
program.
Finally, having said all that, I too have a "vt-100"
program. I use the serial cable from my Palm 3 and a
small program from the internet for the PDA, it only
uses the "scribble" opps, graffity type input from the
stylus but it's still kinda fun. I use it a lot with
the serial interface of microcontrollers. Nothing with
an intensive I/O requirements. It's one of the
gazillion hits on gooogle.
Hope I didn't scare you off, but without any further
information, these are just some of the variables of
the "vt100" and "serial" interface that we all have to
live with.
Cheers,
Rich S.
Please note that the windows (at least 98 and earlier)
terminal program says to 'nix boxes that it's a "vt-100"
type terminal, yet does a rather poor job of doing
cursor manipulation, so you might get some rather strange
output. I "think" that it's still bad on XP, I just don't
remember offhand.
I *STILL* use windoze "telnet" to 'nix boxen, and I just
live with the rather poor job of it doing "vi". Sigh.
(control L is your friend).
Seriously, if you are having problems with your windoze
terminal program talking to your robot, try a live CD
version of linux and "minicom" and see if there is a
happier interface. I would use knoppix, but that is just
personal opinion. The 'nix systems have typically supported
a DEC (Digital Equipment Corp.) VT-100 terminal much
more faithfully as a terminal emulator.
If there is no connection at all, i.e. no characters
coming/going from the interface, you might need a
"null modem". This device interchanges pins 2 and 3
(transmit data and receive data) on a serial interface.
They are available in both DB9 and DB25 versions.
Also, the robot might need some EIA conditioning signals.
Failing the null modem, You might have to put TWO
null modems together.
Usually the null modems wrap DTR/DSR CTS/RTS/DCD together
to fool the DTE that the "modem" is happy and connected.
These are high level one signals. In other words a high
is a logic one.
Then we have to use the terminal program to figure out the
baud rate, number of data bits and parity. Those are all
usually configurable from the desired terminal emulation
program.
Finally, having said all that, I too have a "vt-100"
program. I use the serial cable from my Palm 3 and a
small program from the internet for the PDA, it only
uses the "scribble" opps, graffity type input from the
stylus but it's still kinda fun. I use it a lot with
the serial interface of microcontrollers. Nothing with
an intensive I/O requirements. It's one of the
gazillion hits on gooogle.
Hope I didn't scare you off, but without any further
information, these are just some of the variables of
the "vt100" and "serial" interface that we all have to
live with.
Cheers,
Rich S.
Is the problem simply that the VT-100 is missing? There are numerous VT-100 hardware-compatibles out there. Wyse made some of the better-known ones. For build quality it is hard to beat the DEC terminals. Oh, those happy days on the VAX cluster at university...
----------------------------------
Sometimes I only open my mouth to swap feet...
----------------------------------
ScottyUK
Nah, today is the good days. Now, I can take a cast off PC
that someone has given me and throw an O/S that is very close to UNIX, AND I'M THE ROOT!
Besides, the PC will beat the pants off the VAX.
Someday I should do a Beowolf cluster.
No, I'm not on a power trip. Why do you ask? ;-)
Cheers,
Rich S.
Nah, today is the good days. Now, I can take a cast off PC
that someone has given me and throw an O/S that is very close to UNIX, AND I'M THE ROOT!
Besides, the PC will beat the pants off the VAX.
Someday I should do a Beowolf cluster.
No, I'm not on a power trip. Why do you ask? ;-)
Cheers,
Rich S.
Yeah, but I was about 20 years old back then and I was allowed to chase girls and get drunk with total impunity. Now I get in trouble for doing one and would probably be murdered for the other! And you say these are the good times...?
Solaris 10 is a nice freebie from Sun for the i586 platform but the download is staggeringly huge. You should know better than using CAPITALS in unix: nothing good comes of that ('cept environment variables)...
Sorry to BobM3 for dragging this so far O/T. Perhaps you can clarify whether you just want to ditch the antique VT terminal, or are looking to find a replacement for a missing one?
Solaris 10 is a nice freebie from Sun for the i586 platform but the download is staggeringly huge. You should know better than using CAPITALS in unix: nothing good comes of that ('cept environment variables)...
Sorry to BobM3 for dragging this so far O/T. Perhaps you can clarify whether you just want to ditch the antique VT terminal, or are looking to find a replacement for a missing one?
- Thread starter
- #8
Hi Bob,
Sorry for trashing your thread!
eBay might be a good place to look: UK eBay turned up a few Wyse WT-120's for comically low prices. Look in Computing and then search for "Wyse". Searching for VT-100 was less fruitful, but I did manage to find a genuine DEC VT-320 which would emulate the VT-100 perfectly for the mind-boggling price of £0.99!
Good luck.
----------------------------------
Sometimes I only open my mouth to swap feet...
Sorry for trashing your thread!
eBay might be a good place to look: UK eBay turned up a few Wyse WT-120's for comically low prices. Look in Computing and then search for "Wyse". Searching for VT-100 was less fruitful, but I did manage to find a genuine DEC VT-320 which would emulate the VT-100 perfectly for the mind-boggling price of £0.99!
Good luck.
----------------------------------
The one thing that I like about using a PC instead of a dumb terminal is that, if you use a terminal program that has a macro language, you can automate all kinds of complicated input and output. It's also often handy to be able to log stuff to a file.
I finally lugged my old VT220 dumbterminal off to a recycling center last year after it gathered dust for probably a decade or more.
I finally lugged my old VT220 dumbterminal off to a recycling center last year after it gathered dust for probably a decade or more.
I bought a Wyse color terminal, new, out of pocket, to interface my S-100 computer with the two whopping large 8" 1.2Mb floppies.. Man that was cruisin! I still have the power supply. Weighs about 40 pounds.
Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-
Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-
- Thread starter
- #12
Are you guys saying I could hook a PC to the robot and talk to the robot through the PC using a VT100 emulation program running on the PC? Just buy a 25 Pin D to 9 Pin D cable and connect to the "terminal" connecter on the robot and the 9 pin serial port on the computer?
MikeHalloran
Mechanical
To answer your original question, Bob, the cheapest/easiest way to hook a modern monitor and keyboard to your robot is to use an old computer to glue them all together.
Be aware that it's usually not a plug and play deal, even if you use a real VT-100 terminal. You may need to buy/make a custom cable or special adapter in order to get all the handshake signals and phony handshake signals connected correctly. It's not rocket science, but it can consume a couple of hours, digging up the documents and sketching a diagram of the cable, etc. If you're not up to that, the folks at Black Box can be quite helpful. (
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
Be aware that it's usually not a plug and play deal, even if you use a real VT-100 terminal. You may need to buy/make a custom cable or special adapter in order to get all the handshake signals and phony handshake signals connected correctly. It's not rocket science, but it can consume a couple of hours, digging up the documents and sketching a diagram of the cable, etc. If you're not up to that, the folks at Black Box can be quite helpful. (
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
Yes, it can be a pain to figure out how to connect serial devices together, whether it is a PC or a terminal. Bob, if you can find any documentation on the device that gives details on the serial port, that would be really helpful.
B&B sells some serial adapters and has an FAQ on connecting devices together.
B&B sells some serial adapters and has an FAQ on connecting devices together.
Hi BobM3
"Are you guys saying I could hook a PC to the robot and talk to the robot through the PC using a VT100 emulation program running on the PC? Just buy a 25 Pin D to 9 Pin D cable and connect to the "terminal" connecter on the robot and the 9 pin serial port on the computer?"
Yes. The "just" is getting the pinouts, baud rate,
flow control, parity and control codes correct.
Unfortunately, even if you did get an "original" VT100
terminal, you will STILL have to figure out the pinouts,
baud rate, and parity. So, as mentioned earlier, any
additional information that you can get on the robot
will certianly help!
Their website is not too informative as to communications
information unless one registers? Nor, is there any
guarantee that there will be specific information on an
obsolete (i.e. not documented) robot there.
However, that would be the first place that I would look
to for information.
Unfortunately, a google search on Fanuc rs232 didn't yield
any usfull information.
Hope that this helps.
Cheers,
Rich S.
"Are you guys saying I could hook a PC to the robot and talk to the robot through the PC using a VT100 emulation program running on the PC? Just buy a 25 Pin D to 9 Pin D cable and connect to the "terminal" connecter on the robot and the 9 pin serial port on the computer?"
Yes. The "just" is getting the pinouts, baud rate,
flow control, parity and control codes correct.
Unfortunately, even if you did get an "original" VT100
terminal, you will STILL have to figure out the pinouts,
baud rate, and parity. So, as mentioned earlier, any
additional information that you can get on the robot
will certianly help!
Their website is not too informative as to communications
information unless one registers? Nor, is there any
guarantee that there will be specific information on an
obsolete (i.e. not documented) robot there.
However, that would be the first place that I would look
to for information.
Unfortunately, a google search on Fanuc rs232 didn't yield
any usfull information.
Hope that this helps.
Cheers,
Rich S.
- Thread starter
- #16
I like the idea of using a PC as a "dumb" terminal. I really didn't want to buy an old used VT100. I looked at the Wsye terminals and got a price on a new monitor and keyboard for about $460. Since I have a few old PCs sitting around I think I can spend a few hours on making the cable and swapping pins and still come out ahead. I did find an old Fanuc manual that lists the pin outs on the console's 25 pin connector so I should get a good start. The manual also lists all the registers that store the baud rate and parity etc. I'm going to give it a shot.
Thanks to all for the help.
Thanks to all for the help.
I would absolutely use terminal emulation software on a PC. I would NOT find a serial terminal!!!
Think about it.. Do you ever want to use a laptop instead of a Clunking PC? Yes! So the software emulator is the way to go.
Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-
Think about it.. Do you ever want to use a laptop instead of a Clunking PC? Yes! So the software emulator is the way to go.
Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-
These people might have the answer to your problem.
I have seen this done in our machine shop where the system programmer used a 286 terminal to program two machines that had VT100 terminals.
I have seen this done in our machine shop where the system programmer used a 286 terminal to program two machines that had VT100 terminals.
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- #20
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