Power plant explosion in CT 3

[rbulsara]

A sad accident, details still coming out. There may be more casualties.

Only few miles from me, but I have no other insight.


Rafiq Bulsara

http://www.srengineersct.com

 

[itsmoked]

Good grief!! On Sunday no less?

How do you get an explosion that big in a gas power plant?
Did they charge the whole system with an un-ignited fuel air mix?


Sounds like it:

"They were doing the firing of the engines this morning and so something went wrong and it blew up and flames came shooting up almost as tall as that stack," she told the station.

Keith Cress
kcress -

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[rbulsara]

Local TV news reports it was a natural gas explosion. There was some kind of a test scheduled and something went wrong.

There were 50-100 people around the 'scene' and many were flung 30-50 feet away....



Rafiq Bulsara

http://www.srengineersct.com

 

[ScottyUK]

Thanks Rafiq. A bad day for the workers there. I hope the investigators can establish the root cause so others can learn.


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If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!

 

[itsmoked]

Time for guessing.

Generally these types of disasters are caused by a chain of events, not just one, or they would be far more common.

Perhaps screwing with the DCS ran the entire engine and stack assembly full of air/fuel then they skipped the purge cycle?

Keith Cress
kcress -

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[jraef]

"Construction workers had to move 1.6 million yards of earth and rock to claw out a 137-acre site for the plant on land owned by Middletown trash czar Phil Armetta. He's a former partner in the project who withdrew after he was convicted in a federal crackdown the trash industry."

Can you say "Sopranos"?


"If I had eight hours to chop down a tree, I'd spend six sharpening my axe." -- Abraham Lincoln
For the best use of Eng-Tips, please click here -> faq731-376

 

[rmw]

Whoa!!!!

This one hits way too close to me. I try to reveal as little about my personal self on these sites, but I have a very strong connection to just such a site in the Middletown area, although those don't look like the type of stacks I would recognize nor is the quoted unit MW size quite right for my situation. But the rest is. A lot of the 'buzz words' that the reporters used are part of my daily lexicon.

I can't get the video to run, but I can see the stills, and some of it looks familiar.

None the less, the thought remains that this is a potential at any site I visit and could have been me instead of those poor lads.

Way too close for comfort.

rmw

 

[GTstartup]

My understanding (from on line)is that it was a gas explosion during gas blow the unit wasn't running. Often actual gas volume and pressure is needed to clean the gas line. It is normally vented to atmosphere but i could see where a combination of vent stack too low and weather conditions could cause a build up of gas. Or perhaps it was just a comnno or garden gas leak.

 

[rasevskii]

In fact there are a rather large number of such events during commissioning tests, usually involving only electrical accidents, but nothing is reported in the media unless there is a loss of life.

In my time I have seen a 31 MVA transformer blow up, one person killed in a 60kV indoor substation, two hydroelectric accidents, one of which flooded a station up to tailwater level, an excitation transformer destroyed by wrong connected secondary cables, an electrician burned in a 415V panel, a grounding switch closed in on a live 154kV line, and numerous near-misses.

And that was all before we had computers and software dependent control systems...

regards, rasevskii

 

[ScottyUK]

Wait for the investigation guys. I can remember how angry I was at the erroneous speculation, and the idiot reporters who encouraged it, after the huge explosion at my former plant. At the time it amazed me how many people were experts on power plants but had never actually been in one.


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If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!

 

[amptramp]

People:

There is a thread in Pat's Pub on this post's subject. One interesting link in that thread:

http://www.csb.gov/newsroom/detail.aspx?nid=304

The story is here:

http://www.wral.com/news/local/story/5349408/

 

[rbulsara]

amptramp:

The event you posted is a different one from the one in the OP. Different State, day and company.

Rafiq Bulsara

http://www.srengineersct.com

 

[amptramp]

rbulsara

I apologize for the lack of clarity. The link to the "story" I posted was related to the CSB link posted immediately above it. I was providing background information for the CSB article.

 

[davidbeach]

And both of amptramp's links are about the type of explosion that happen at the plant in CT.

 

[rbulsara]

I see the erring similarities! Although not much details have come out of the CT incident.

But you cannot make codes against stupidity.

I am flabbergasted to read this in amptramps' link:

CSB investigations supervisor Donald Holmstrom said his team made the recommendations to the board during the course of the ConAgra investigation after discovering gaps in the fuel gas codes. “Purging flammable gases into building interiors is a recipe for disaster. At ConAgra, we determined the accident would not have happened had the gas been vented safely outdoors through a hose or pipe.” Mr. Holmstrom noted that since the June 2009 accident, ConAgra has instituted strict policies on purging, requiring it be done to safe outdoor locations.

NO SH&%!

I hope purging flammable gas in building interiors is not as common as it is stated above.



Rafiq Bulsara

http://www.srengineersct.com

 

[rmw]

I am with Scotty on this one. Way too many speculations by people who can barely spell power plant. We do know that a terrible event has happened, but I tend to wait until those who "speak the language" give the official report. I've just seen too much garbage (rubbish) put out by media journalists.

rmw

 

[racobb]

Agreed.....but at least we are not the media!

Alan

 

[itsmoked]

Well, I rather disagree. I'm not with Scotty on this.

Discussing things like this disaster is how we learn. Saying "don't talk about it until some investigator/tion is done" is NOT helpful and is a poor way to learn anything.

Likely we would never discuss it a year after the fact. How do the investigators do this? They start speculating, (educated guessing), the moment they know anything. Then they fastidiously try to keep an open mind. They don't go take pictures and then stare at them until The Cause jumps out at them.

I'd never even heard of purging as being a problem until yesterday. It could be it wasn't the actual problem, I don't care. If it isn't I'll learn something else!

Sometimes people who say don't, "discuss or speculate", have been caught in discussing and speculating who's at fault and are leery of preliminary discussions. I don't blame them a bit and can understand their reticence.

Blame is not what I'm interested in, I'm interested in science and technology and learning about possible work place hazards.

Keith Cress
kcress -

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[alehman]

Well stated, Keith. I also agree with racobb's statement, but in the literal sense. Hopefully we here are better qualified to discuss such things than the average reporter.

Alan
“The engineer's first problem in any design situation is to discover what the problem really is.” Unk.

 

[Skogsgurra]

For several reasons, I am with both Scotty AND Smoked. Waiting for a (hopefully) qualified view on what happened is good and what we usually do.

But I have been through several investigations where the 'qualified view' is anything but 'qualified'. In most cases, there was an insurance company steering the investigation and in one case, the Union had the final say.

I actually once could prove that a rather big fire in an electrical room in a power plant didn't start at all as the insurance company and the VBCC* said it started. Most of that investigation involved own searches (many photographs taken) and also discussing with people that were no experts in the particular field of technology, but had made observations that added details to the pcture.

That is, as I see it, Smoked's view.

I also fully agree with Scotty that speculations in the tabloids very seldom add any value to an ongoing investigation and that we, qualified or not, usually are in no better position to speculate than their journalists. Simply because we very seldom have the facts.

This unnecessary and sad accident verifies again that no security standards or rules can replace education, craftmanship, insight and experience.


*Very Big Consultant Company

Gunnar Englund

http://www.gke.org

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