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Ozone hole ? 6
- Thread starter rb1957
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- Thread starter
- #2
NASA apparently thinks that it'll be in the 2065 before ozone depletion recovers. At least, with the Montreal protocol, the hole area has somewhat plateaued. The 2nd link's video has a graphic showing the ozone hole chlorine level decreasing
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
Maybe it's just governmentspeak to make you think they have done something. I was unaware of the problem; I thought it had been 'solved'.
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
It had, in the sense that they banned most chemicals that resulted in ozone depletion, but not everyone had actually gotten rid of them, or stopped making them. I distinctly remember that I could still get real Freon© from Mexico, nearly 10 years after it wasn't available in the US, like around the 1997 timeframe. If you squint hard enough, the first graph seems to show some downward trend occurring in the last decade
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
- Thread starter
- #6
I'm trying to find some data ... not just a video of a "talking head" (ok, maybe she's the lead investigator). She did "blab" on about cold temperatures affecting the ozone level, and didn't say anything like the obvious "we normalised the results for temperature". Of course that'd involve some normalising coefficients (which may be speculative). But if you synchronize ozone level and temperature then you'd see "oh, this was a warm year, that's why the small hole" (or the other way round ... warm = large hole).
What I have found is from "Wattsup" ...
which says that more study revealed a hitherto unknown reaction creates molecular Cl from seawater.
We see that so often ... more research reveals deeper mechanisms and deeper understanding (and more questions).
Now could a source of molecular CL inside the polar region be responsible for the free CL at altitude ? (rather than CFCs liberated, to a large extent, on the other side of the equator). Maybe they can show (by isotopes?) that yes this Cl came from a CFC ?
"Hoffen wir mal, dass alles gut geht !"
General Paulus, Nov 1942, outside Stalingrad after the launch of Operation Uranus.
What I have found is from "Wattsup" ...
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2014/01/15/high-levels-of-molecular-chlorine-found-in-arctic-atmosphere/
...which says that more study revealed a hitherto unknown reaction creates molecular Cl from seawater.
We see that so often ... more research reveals deeper mechanisms and deeper understanding (and more questions).
Now could a source of molecular CL inside the polar region be responsible for the free CL at altitude ? (rather than CFCs liberated, to a large extent, on the other side of the equator). Maybe they can show (by isotopes?) that yes this Cl came from a CFC ?
"Hoffen wir mal, dass alles gut geht !"
General Paulus, Nov 1942, outside Stalingrad after the launch of Operation Uranus.
Nearly all foam insulations 'off gas' and the old products are still out there and will be for a few decades I suspect. Same with old refrigerant units... as they age, they maybe leak... just a thought. ![[pipe]](/data/assets/smilies/pipe.gif "[pipe] [pipe]")
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
rb, my last link is one of the publications from her, but I think the issue has been the extremely difficult challenge of getting decent measurements
dik, sure, there's plenty of that, my own house's A/C still has its original charge from when we installed it in 1994, and my house that we bought in 2009 supposedly had Freon, even though that A/C was installed in 2007
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
dik, sure, there's plenty of that, my own house's A/C still has its original charge from when we installed it in 1994, and my house that we bought in 2009 supposedly had Freon, even though that A/C was installed in 2007
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
TugboatEng
Marine/Ocean
Solar winds and temperature have great effect on the thickness of the ozone layer. Apparently, in 2004 60% of our upper ozone layer was lost due to solar winds.
JoshPlumSE
Structural
I'm curious how much of the effect the ozone hole could have on global warming.
It may be more localized at the south or north poles. But that extra radiation could have an effect, right?
It may be more localized at the south or north poles. But that extra radiation could have an effect, right?
a link...
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
TugboatEng
Marine/Ocean
The union of concerned scientists is not as credible as their name would lead you to believe.
TugboatEng
Marine/Ocean
Yes, they neglected to mention the fact that solar winds caused a loss of 60% of the ozone layer 4 years before their article was written and make no mention of that non-man-made phenomenon.
an omission, but it still doesn't render the rest of the information as useless. I don't know what the state of the art was back 10 years ago with respect to solar winds... maybe solar winds may be active, or maybe just another 'red herring'.
This article from NASA, apparently 2 days ago fails to mention solar winds. The references date back a decade. Part of the problem is the articles are undated:
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
This article from NASA, apparently 2 days ago fails to mention solar winds. The references date back a decade. Part of the problem is the articles are undated
:So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates
-Dik
TugboatEng
Marine/Ocean
Oh it's not useless. It's quite useful. It's intended to steer your opinion, it's not intended to inform. UCS is a political think tank and not actually a union of scientists.
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1
- #19
The solar wind depletion effect only impacted 2004, which is what NASA's graph shows and what was reported in the literature
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
TugboatEng
Marine/Ocean
Thanka, IR. And that jives with my understanding that the sun is on a 22 year solar cycle. In fact, we are on track to be impacted by a flare that has occurred recently.
This is the least sensational source I can find. It was supposed to impact a week ago:
This is the least sensational source I can find. It was supposed to impact a week ago:
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