Open vs enclosed, partially enclosed 1

[JStructsteel]

Got a lean-to covered addition for a bar I am looking at. Its open walls, covered roof. Do you folks assume that some point it will be enclosed, i.e. winter or fall they put up the plastic wall things?

 

[BAretired]

That would be a conservative, but sensible assumption.

BA

 

[JStructsteel]

Thanks BA. Seems best to do it that way. If it fouls my design considerably, will pull back and consider other options.

 

[KootK]

I agree that would be a conservative and sensible assumption. That's not always what I do though. I like happy clients and often design quite aggressively to try to make them happy. In this instance, I'd explain the implications to the client, take my direction from them, and state my assumptions in my drawings.

If you got a peak at all of the hyper-aggressive assumptions that the skyscraper firms make to get their stuff to work efficiently, you'd not be losing much sleep over stuff like this.

 

[skeletron]

@KootK: gonna ask you a philosophical and tangential question from this thread...Do you address every assumption in your analysis on the drawings, or leave some up to the (competitor/client's) imagination? For example, in this case, would you be outlining "assumed closed structure" or do you just give the bare minimum design loads and leave it at that on the drawings. I'm just wondering if you pepper the drawing with notes that limit your liability by being really specific, or if you take a 180 degree strategy and just give the bare minimum so it can be pencilled out.

 

[KootK]

@skeletron: I would answer that I use my judgment selectively. Unless the stating of an assumption is a requirement, I'll only include it if I feel that there's a reasonable expectation that the owner of the structure might be able to modify their behavior to be consistent with my assumption. For this particular case, I believe that stating the assumption that structure being "open" is part of the design criteria that should be on the drawings for the benefit of future, renovating/evaluating engineers in addition to the owner. Adding some layman's verbiage to the tune of "don't wall this thing in" is, of course, the discretionary part. And I would put that on my drawings.

 

[Tomfh]

If you got a peak at all of the hyper-aggressive assumptions that the skyscraper firms make to get their stuff to work efficiently,.

That’d be an interesting thread.