Model vs. Layout1

[dogleg43]

Here is an AutoCAD for dummie question:
Why are some drawings created in under the "Model" tab and others in the "Layout1" tab?

I edit a lot of drawings but am by no means an expert. I am having a difficult time editing or manipulating drawings done in the "Layout1" tab.

I am using AutoCAD Electrical 2008, but edit drawings saved in all different versions of ACAD.

 

[atook]

The layout tab (paper space)is where you typically draw up the titleblock and stuff. Where you create the "paper" drawing. Think of it as a sheet of paper with a window cut in it to the actual drawing. That window is called a viewport.

The model tab (model space)is where the drawing data of whatever the project is typically lives.

Unless you're changing titleblock stuff (text, logos, dates, etc) you should probably be in model space.



Tim Grote - The Irrigation Engineers.

http://www.irrigationengineers.com

 

[TDAA]

Yes, everything that is associated with the drawing itself should be in model, excluding the title block, etc. as noted above.

It is a real pain to see someone label things in paperspace, and then need to shift the model drawing over. Now none of the labels match.

 

[francesca]

CHSPACE command allows you to switch objects between Paper and Model space.

 

[cfee]

IDAA- You're absolutely right, but I use chspace for this problem with great success !

dogleg43- You can adapt this strategy for electrical and electronic drawings, too -

Model space is where you'd draw the drawing. Some will dimension in model space and some on the viewport tab (paperspace). About the only thing I'd put in model space (model tab) other than the drawing itself, might be dimensions, and that only if absolutely necessary. For me, one HUGE advantage of drawing in model space and everything else in paperspace is that I only have to draw my drawing once. Then I can zoom in on various parts for details into viewports. This is especially effective for assemblies where different components can be designed assembled together and then only that component's layer is turned on in a single viewport. With dimensioning and labeling all in paperspace, layer management is absolutely minimized. If you don't want all your parts in one assembly drawing with views of each component on its own tab each with its own T-Block for that part, then do the assembly drawing in a seperate drawing file, and X-Ref it in. The rest is the same, and you can use the one assembly drawing into as many discrete part drawings as you wish ! The cool thing about x-ref'ing the assembly in is that everything edited into the assembly drawing later, automatically updates in every drawing that uses that ex-ref . You'll have some cleanup, but the advantage can be huge !

This only scratches the surface. Learn the SOLDRAW, etc commands for creating & managing viewports. Put the newly created viewport on a layer call it maybe V-Ports or some such, make that layer color light grey (#9) and mark it to not print in layer control. Don't play around with defpoints layer... Then lock the layer to control zooming.

And this doesn't even BEGIN to touch on the advantages of paperspace viewports in ACAD 3D Modeling ! hint- after creating the 3D model in modelspace and extracting its first views into paperspace tabs, DON'T EDIT the model in modelspace anymore. Huh ? Extract one viewport to a 2-D projection (solprof) and you'll see why. Instead, create a paperspace tab at the end of the tabs at the bottom of your screen, give it one viewport, zoom extents in paperspace to that viewport, DON'Tlock this one, double-click into it, zoom your model into it AND EDIT YOUR 3D MODEL THERE ! All the extracted-view layers stay off and you get full control of your model !

Ok, this is all just a strategy, but that's what makes AutoCAD SO powerful ! Each person can develop their most effective strategy that marries the needs of their particular job with their particular skill set and learning level !

Good luck and let us know how it goes !

 

[brandoncdg]

Yes the best thing is that in model space you can xref a drawing under -XR1 layer and then xref that same drawing under -XRSCREENED layer and manipulate colors in one or multiple viewports on your paperspace sheet. Multiple viewports is how you blow up a detail quickly. The freeze a layer button is very handy in this situation as well.

I think the easiest drawings to work on are everything goes into model except general notes and titleblock.

Then you can choose to either put each sheet in a layout tab or every sheet lined up in Layout1. Don't forget to rename Layout1.

Civil Development Group, LLC
Los Angeles Civil Engineering specializing in Hillside Grading

http://civildevelopmentgroup.com

http://civildevelopmentgroup.com/blog

 

[cvg]

geez, I wonder what we were able to accomplish in version 10 before they came out with paperspace or xrefs... Seriously, these features have been around in Autocad for 20 years. I assume you are not using drawings originally created in version 9 or possibly drawings created by some other cad program?

Yes, you can draw everything in model space or in paper space. For simple electrical schematics, maybe it makes no difference. Or maybe the cad operator or engineer who created your drawing just doesn't have much experience with Autocad.

 

[cfee]

cvg- yes we were able to do everything we needed to without any of this in versions at r-10 or earlier. With the advent of P-Space at r-11 we discovered the advantages of using paperspace viewports, and the race was ON ! These tools like x-refing were developed to meet a need, and
I think they've matured very well. I think your guess is probably right- the person originating the drawings may have done it that way out of convenience or maybe a lack of familiarity. Either way they did what they could with what they had !

 

[zdas04]

God, I hate to get drawings from OLD TIME CAD operators with the title block in model space and everything in yellow. I have a couple of clients that send me stuff like that to modify. I change it (moving the title blocks and dimensions to paper space) and the originators scream and move everything back. Going back and forth is not a trivial task, but going away from only model space is just good.

David

 

[cvg]

don't blame it on the "old timers", I learned (taught myself) on version 2.5 without a mouse... I fully embrace colors, paper space and xrefs.

These single space - single color "OLD TIME CAD operators" are just blockheads that refuse to learn new and better ways of doing things like using more than one layer. Or they created the drawing in microstation and converted it to acad for your use...

 

[RHTPE]

dogleg43 - I recently worked with a drawing created by my former peers of 11 years ago. Most of the building was drawn in Model Space and all of the details drawn on Layout tabs (Paper Space) at real-world dimensions with the title blocks scaled to fit around them.

When I started at my most recent position in 2000, everyone there was ignoring Paper Space. It took me all of 3 months to educate them in the application of Paper Space v. Model Space - now, not one of them would give up Paper Space.

To me, it's just an example of folks who truly do NOT understand the concept of Paper Space and are unwilling to commit a bit of time to learn new features.

And I'm one of those "Old-timers" - who enthusiastically embraced Paper Space - once I learned how to apply it (about one release after it was introduced). AutoCAD's help files really didn't explain the concept very well - only how to do settings - but one needed to understand the concept before the settings meant anything.


Ralph
Structures Consulting
Northeast USA