The magneto we are using on our 12 cylinder Waukesha engine needs a voltage of 150-190 to enable the start-up. This mangeto was functioning properly until we had to shut down the compressor station for a period of 4 months. Now the voltage we are getting is 35V on the 12 cylinders which is not adequate to cause ignition. The G-leed is giving 160v. Can a magneto go bad if left for some time and what could be the cause??
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Issue with Magneto 4
- Thread starter Kene1
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- #2
They usually have points in them. When running lots of chemistry occurs to the points due to the arcing and ozone around them. If they then sit unused for an extended period they can often fail due to oxidation or them being coated with some sort of poor conducting layer. I'd move the engine until the points are closed then run some emerycloth between them as the first step.
Keith Cress
kcress -
Keith Cress
kcress -
- Thread starter
- #4
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- Moderator
- #5
Some magnetos have a mechanical impulse generator to increase the voltage at cranking speeds.
There is a spring connection between the input shaft and the rotor.
The rotor is held by a stop for a few degrees and then released.
This loads up the spring and then gives a snap action and a retarded spark for starting.
The action is disabled by centrifugal action at higher speeds.
If the mag has a centrifugal advance it may have this feature included.
Look for a stiff linkage or hard grease.
--------------------
Ohm's law
Not just a good idea;
It's the LAW!
There is a spring connection between the input shaft and the rotor.
The rotor is held by a stop for a few degrees and then released.
This loads up the spring and then gives a snap action and a retarded spark for starting.
The action is disabled by centrifugal action at higher speeds.
If the mag has a centrifugal advance it may have this feature included.
Look for a stiff linkage or hard grease.
--------------------
Ohm's law
Not just a good idea;
It's the LAW!
catserveng
Electrical
Altronic III magneto's don't have points or an impulse coupling, an Altronic Manual for the type magneto shown in the picture is attached.
I think you posted this in multiple areas, I answered somewhere else, please post your questions in a single area. It is also appreciated if you would provide feedback as to what you find.
Bill/Keith, I have been working on industrial gas engines for over 40 years, impulse couplings and point style magneto's haven't been in production since before I started working on them. The Fairbanks magneto's used both, and have worked on older units with them, but they usually got replaced with a newer magneto instead of repaired, at least in my experience. The Altronic and newer electronic Fairbanks magnetos were far superior in performance and reliability.
Last point style magneto with an impulse coupling I worked on was about 10 years ago on a 1950's vintage unit, was replaced with a digital ignition system.
To the OP, hope this helps.
MikeL.
I think you posted this in multiple areas, I answered somewhere else, please post your questions in a single area. It is also appreciated if you would provide feedback as to what you find.
Bill/Keith, I have been working on industrial gas engines for over 40 years, impulse couplings and point style magneto's haven't been in production since before I started working on them. The Fairbanks magneto's used both, and have worked on older units with them, but they usually got replaced with a newer magneto instead of repaired, at least in my experience. The Altronic and newer electronic Fairbanks magnetos were far superior in performance and reliability.
Last point style magneto with an impulse coupling I worked on was about 10 years ago on a 1950's vintage unit, was replaced with a digital ignition system.
To the OP, hope this helps.
MikeL.
- Moderator
- #7
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Indeed! I've carefully updated my mememeoray blank. I have a single magneto around here and it has both! LOL
It's out of a helicopter. By connecting all the metal chips together it easily set a greasy crowded workbench on fire.
Keith Cress
kcress -
It's out of a helicopter. By connecting all the metal chips together it easily set a greasy crowded workbench on fire.
Keith Cress
kcress -
- Thread starter
- #9
Thanks for the response to this thread, please also see the mail below as response from Altronic.
Kene,
G-Lead that has 160v seems to be adequate, and depending on how it is measured may be normal. If it is 160V on the G-lead, I am not sure how you think it has 35v on the 12 cylinders as the output to the cylinders comes from the G-lead. The pulse to the cylinders cannot be measured unless an oscilloscope is used as the pulse to the coil is only about 40uS, and cannot be measured with a digital meter.
The best way to test for firing is to use an inductive timing light on the primary going to a coil. If it triggers the timing light then the Altronic III is firing into the coil.
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catserveng
Electrical
If you look at pg 16 of the manual I sent you, you'll see a schematic diagram for the magneto. The "G" pin is used to shutoff the magneto output, note that it connects directly to the rectified alternator output, and does not go to the circuit board or distribution coils. So if you have 160 volts on the "G" pin, the alternator and rectifier are ok, but doesn't tell you what the distribution part of the magneto is doing. Since you have a box of "spare" magneto's, try swapping the end plate assembly from the best looking one to your magneto on engine. Just make sure you get the timing right.
A timing light on the primary leads to the coil is a good way to check, but not all timing lights work on magneto systems, here is the one i use,
If you want to use a scope to diagnose your problem, I use a Fluke Scopemeter with an 80i-110s current probe, works more reliably and gives a better signal than trying to use an inductive voltage probe. The autoset feature will usually give you a pretty good reading of the primary pulse to the coil.
MikeL.
A timing light on the primary leads to the coil is a good way to check, but not all timing lights work on magneto systems, here is the one i use,
If you want to use a scope to diagnose your problem, I use a Fluke Scopemeter with an 80i-110s current probe, works more reliably and gives a better signal than trying to use an inductive voltage probe. The autoset feature will usually give you a pretty good reading of the primary pulse to the coil.
MikeL.
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