Insurance Question 1

[SteelPE]

I started in the engineering business in 1999 right our of college. I went to work with an older gentleman who, at the time, was planning on getting out of the business. He had hung his own shingle in 1995. I worked with him for the next 12 years until his passing in 2011. During that time I became licensed and was added to his insurance. Once he passed I decided to continue on and have had some decent success since 2011 only changing the name to reflect my name vs his.

I am currently looking at my PL insurance policy for 25-26. He is still listed on the policy as an additional insured (even though he is deceased) with a retroactive date for when he started his own (1995). I don't think it costs me anything to have him on the policy as this was negotiated when I switched policies in 2016.... but at some point, would it be beneficial at all to at least drop him from my insurance? Is it bad to have him on my insurance (I don't see why)?

I am just not sure what I am currently doing is right here.

 

[driftLimiter]

If you have a decent insurance broker they should be your first point of contact with this question.

You are in essence covering his work from long ago. Since you two worked together it may make sense....

 

[phamENG]

Does he still have an active estate? If so, having his name on there may be giving protection the assets in that estate should anything he was involved with have problems. Though, at this point, you're likely well beyond the timeframes that that would matter.

Might be a good thing to discuss with your agent.

 

[KootK]

I'd want to pull his name off just for the sake of administrative and legal tidiness.

That said, the only real risk that I can think of is if someone steals his license number and starts sealing stuff. As remote a possibility as that is, I'm actually guilty of having inadvertently stolen a dead guy's license before. Even at that, I'm sure that you could lawyer your way out of any real consequences even if that did happen.

As for the gentleman's previous projects, my understanding is that they would remain covered by your insurance policy even after you have him removed as an additional insured. I believe that anything that has ever been insured by your policy remains insured by that policy so long as you maintain it.

 

[Ron247]

I'm actually guilty of having inadvertently stolen a dead guy's license before.

Sorry folks, I gotta ask. How did you "inadvertently" get some dead guys license. Is it like when I inadvertently walked out of a bank with all the money from their vault?

Better check with an attorney. There is ultimately a reason names appear on some legal documents. Who is being protected or exposed is usually the reasoning.

 

[KootK]

Sorry folks, I gotta ask. How did you "inadvertently" get some dead guys license.

One day I was under considerable pressure to procure a WA digital stamp to accompany my longstanding WA SE license. I couldn't find what I needed from my usual Stamps-R-Us place for some reason so I called WA and asked them what I ought to do. They said that they didn't publish a graphic standard and suggested that I make my own stamp image using whatever graphics tool I preferred. It just had to be a normal-ish size and show the right information. Seriously. At the time, I thought this was pretty awesome of them. Very West Coast.

As per usual, I was doing 473 things simultaneously while also making my own WA SE stamp. One of those thing involved creating an invoice with my US ZIP code pasted into it (494XX) which has a format rather similar to my WA SE license number (444XX). I wound up pasting my ZIP code into my DIY stamp image and, as it turns out, my ZIP code exactly matches the license number of a deceased Washington state structural engineer (although my name does not).

The next thing that I know I've got a client complaining that the Bellevue AHJ has rejected their permit application because the drawings were stamped by a deceased structural engineer. Which was... a tad embarrassing.

 

[Ron247]

Y

suggested that I make my own stamp image using whatever graphics tool I preferred.

Please tell me you used a big red set of smacking lips on the seal and wrote "Sealed With a Kiss" on it somewhere since they had no standard. I bet then they would have adopted a standard, probably a Big Red Set of Smacking Lips.

Also may want to confirm they were not the original engineer on Tacoma Narrows.

 

[KootK]

I'm no graphics designer and the exercise wound up being obnoxiously difficult. I wanted something that looked kind of legit so I googled a WA stamp from a PDF drawing set, pasted that into Bluebeam, and then created the radiused text of my name in Word.

It took endless trial and error to get the font and curvature even close to accurate such that the stamp didn't look like a complete fraud. And even at that, I couldn't get rid of that hideous outline around my name that looks just like it would have if I'd done this in 1970 with cutout newspaper letters like the Unabomber. The fake DL that I made to get into bars when I was 17 was better.

A few years later, WA developed a standard stamp (free from their website IIRC) and I jumped on that in a hurry. It's no wonder Bellevue flagged the thing.

No exaggeration, I probably spent 3HR billable on that damn stamp. In my defense, It does look a bit better at its intended scale.

 

[BAretired]

I started in the engineering business in 1999 right our of college. I went to work with an older gentleman who, at the time, was planning on getting out of the business. He had hung his own shingle in 1995. I worked with him for the next 12 years until his passing in 2011. During that time I became licensed and was added to his insurance. Once he passed I decided to continue on and have had some decent success since 2011 only changing the name to reflect my name vs his.

I am currently looking at my PL insurance policy for 25-26. He is still listed on the policy as an additional insured (even though he is deceased) with a retroactive date for when he started his own (1995). I don't think it costs me anything to have him on the policy as this was negotiated when I switched policies in 2016.... but at some point, would it be beneficial at all to at least drop him from my insurance? Is it bad to have him on my insurance (I don't see why)?

I am just not sure what I am currently doing is right here.

My advice is to leave his name on the policy. In that way his estate will be covered into the future. A lawyer I knew some time ago was glad that she purchased professional liability insurance for her dad, a professional engineer, after he died. A claim was made against his estate for work which had been performed by his firm. The firm no longer existed and there was nobody left to sue.

 

[Ron247]

No exaggeration, I probably spent 3HR billable on that damn stamp. In my defense, It does look a bit better at its intended scale.

I am sure at its intended scale, the picture looks more like George, than Martha.

 

[lexpatrie]

Well Koot, you had no demonstrable intent to deceive, so I'd argue it's a typo. You didn't steal the guy's license.

Further, Unabomber was 1990s, but I suppose you're right that the start was back in 1978.

 

[KootK]

Well Koot, you had no demonstrable intent to deceive, so I'd argue it's a typo.

Thanks. WA DOL was very cool about it actually. I shot them an email, explained the situation, and asked what my penance might have to be. And that was limited to being a little more careful in the future. Now, if that were Illinois or British Columbia....

I should probably just keep my fool mouth shut. I only got my BC license reinstated last month after taking a few liberties with my PDH regimen.

 

[skeletron]

If your previous partner passed in 2011, wouldn't this fall under the statute of limitations in the near future. 15-20 years depending on your area?

 

[Rabbit12]

I'd want to pull his name off just for the sake of administrative and legal tidiness.

That said, the only real risk that I can think of is if someone steals his license number and starts sealing stuff. As remote a possibility as that is, I'm actually guilty of having inadvertently stolen a dead guy's license before. Even at that, I'm sure that you could lawyer your way out of any real consequences even if that did happen.

As for the gentleman's previous projects, my understanding is that they would remain covered by your insurance policy even after you have him removed as an additional insured. I believe that anything that has ever been insured by your policy remains insured by that policy so long as you maintain it.

Somewhat similar story. I was reviewing a set of calculations for guardrail/handrail from a vendor one day. The calculations were old and didn't match the design. They were stamped so I looked up the gentleman whose name was on the stamp. His licensed had lapsed or expired. I suspected the vendor didn't have permission to use the calcs so I called the office of the engineering firm. The lady who answered the phone got quiet when I asked to speak to the gentleman on the stamp and relayed to me that he was deceased.

I explained the situation to her, and she forwarded my call to the president of their company. I explained the situation to him, and he asked me to send him an email with the documents in question. I suspect he called the vendor and had a conversation with them.

 

[XR250]

Thanks. WA DOL was very cool about it actually. I shot them an email, explained the situation, and asked what my penance might have to be. And that was limited to being a little more careful in the future. Now, if that were Illinois or British Columbia....

I should probably just keep my fool mouth shut. I only got my BC license reinstated last month after taking a few liberties with my PDH regimen.

View attachment 15596

Did not realize KootK was such a scofflaw. Just when you think you know someone....