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How to work in Formula1?
- Thread starter GOLFF
- Start date
patprimmer
New member
If you have an accounting degree, you might get a job as a teams financial controller.
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.
SomptingGuy
Automotive
Just flicking through the job section of "Automotive Engineer", Spetember 2007 I see Mercedes Benz High Performance Engines has a full page spread with many positions of all types (design/simulation/planning/controls/reliability/performance dev/trackside).
I've seen many F1 jobs (mainly from the UK-based teams) advertised in this publication. This month's is not at all unusual.
I've seen many F1 jobs (mainly from the UK-based teams) advertised in this publication. This month's is not at all unusual.
SomptingGuy
Automotive
Just to clarify, since the magazine title is pretty generic:
Note that other than IMechE membership, I'm not in any way affiliated with this magazine - just a regular reader.
Note that other than IMechE membership, I'm not in any way affiliated with this magazine - just a regular reader.
GregLocock
Automotive
In the last two or three years I have also seen job adverts for Mclaren and Renault, so there is no great secret to finding the jobs.
You'll need good grades from a good uni and racing experience will probably help.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
You'll need good grades from a good uni and racing experience will probably help.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
EfiOz
Automotive
- Feb 10, 2004
- 18
A word of warning. It is nowhere near as glamorous as you might think. If working 100 hours a week in a cubicle blows your skirt up then be my guest. As an engine guy, your design is severely hampered by the aero guys who rule the roost when it comes to laying down a new genesis.
And don't even think you'll ever see a race track, unless you're on your holidays.
And don't even think you'll ever see a race track, unless you're on your holidays.
patprimmer
New member
Where does it say he is an engine guy.
The OP does not give the slightest hint as to what qualifications he has or what part he wants to play, hence my comment about accounting. I hoped it might demonstrate just how ridiculously general his question was and therefore prompt something more specific.
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.
The OP does not give the slightest hint as to what qualifications he has or what part he wants to play, hence my comment about accounting. I hoped it might demonstrate just how ridiculously general his question was and therefore prompt something more specific.
Regards
eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.
Greg Locock is on the right track. Try to get some practical experience working in the area that interests you most, possibly in one of the lesser formula race teams first.
Be very patient and work towards your dream in small steps. If you have real talent, you may be noticed. If you can gain a reputation and demonstrate some success, sending a detailed CV to the various F1 race teams is not going to hurt.
Be very patient and work towards your dream in small steps. If you have real talent, you may be noticed. If you can gain a reputation and demonstrate some success, sending a detailed CV to the various F1 race teams is not going to hurt.
SomptingGuy
Automotive
I've been poking around the FSAE forums and it does seem that an FSAE (or equivalent) connection can get a fresh grad into F1 (etc) without the need for several years of relevant (paid) experience.
Silverbullet86
Mechanical
participating in FSAE isn't your key into Formula 1, however it opens doors to many automotive engineering career paths. Getting a job at Formula 1 is like getting a job at NASA. Its huge, and is considered one of the world's most technically advanced machines.
GregLocock
Automotive
...and I know at least two people who worked in F1 straight from uni.
They didn't do FSAE, but it wouldn't hurt.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
FSAE is a great project for forumla 1 because instead of the project's goal to build a weekend racer that has some ridiculously small option of mass production, you focus on generating the most ridiculous stuff that will never see production and the judges reward you for it. Items such as 8 piston monoblock titanium calipers with custom brake pads come to mind. Those now are incredibly useful on a 400lb car that will never see more than 80mph. You get penalized for just grabbing a dynalite willwood caliper off the shelf and go. It doesn't matter if they both brake the same distance, it's about complication. The most complicated car with more tech bells and whistles wins. Who needs off the shelf parts anyway? Solid racing fundamentals haven't won a competition there yet and never will unfortunately. About a third of the cars retire at some point because of this.
- Thread starter
- #15
MargayKart79
Mechanical
Just be aware when you work in environment so advanced your broken off into a group, say suspension, and then get to focus and test one element of that. You really need to love the aspect your working on rather than the big picture. Which is why focusing on a particular system might help in your search.
If your on a low budget kart racing allows you the freedom of making your own parts and racing it yourself for a good thrill and low overhead. Its a good way to get cheap racing experience.
If your on a low budget kart racing allows you the freedom of making your own parts and racing it yourself for a good thrill and low overhead. Its a good way to get cheap racing experience.
GregLocock
Automotive
That's a good point about specialisation - one of the guys I mentioned was designing con rods for 3 years.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
SomptingGuy
Automotive
Hamilton's race engineer started out by analysing dampers.
Do you want to sit in a cubicle designing and optimizing parts using CATIA? Then go to school, study engineering, ace your marks, learn solid modeling and FEA, and get a job. It is not much different than trying to get a job with an aerospace firm. And it is not much more exciting. That is not what you want though.
You want to be a Race Engineer. Understand that for the type of position you probably want, there are only a few hundred positions in existence…in the world. Probably less than 50 in F1. How do you get there?
Get a degree in Mechanical Engineering. Before you start your studies…get this book --Race Car Vehicle Dynamics by Milliken. Also read ALL of Carol Smiths books. Use these to guide the things you study. Concentrate on understanding tire dynamics, dampers, and overall vehicle behavior. These are the fundamentals of Race Engineering. You must study a variety of complimentary fields: Materials Science, Metallurgy, Design, FEA, Aerodynamics and AeroElasticity. Take Claude Rouelle’s Race Engineering Seminars. Learn to use data systems as a tool for Race Engineering. Learn to use the Vehicle Sim Packages out there.
After you have done all this, you will have to go to work in a Jr level formulae team as a grunt. You will have to sweep floors, change tires, change engines. To do this, you will need hands on value to them. You must be an excellent mechanic. Some sort of certification helps…you can even work for a while as a mechanic for an arrive and drive school series or race car driving school…that will give you a good idea about basic racecar setup. Being a good welder and machinist to boot will not hurt.
This MIGHT give you enough overall skills to impress a Jr. race team into giving you a shot. They will not hire you because you are an engineer. In fact, if you tell them you are an engineer…they will roll their eyes! Trust me. Don’t tell them. Show them. From that point on it will be politics and maneuvering yourself into the position of being a race engineer involved in testing and race day set up. Then you can apply what you know. Either that…or if you have a half million to million $ you want to put at risk…start your own team!
Then the rest is simple. Win and don’t stop winning. 2.0LFF, F3, GP2….then F1. In reality, it is very much like being a driver. You must win.
You want to be a Race Engineer. Understand that for the type of position you probably want, there are only a few hundred positions in existence…in the world. Probably less than 50 in F1. How do you get there?
Get a degree in Mechanical Engineering. Before you start your studies…get this book --Race Car Vehicle Dynamics by Milliken. Also read ALL of Carol Smiths books. Use these to guide the things you study. Concentrate on understanding tire dynamics, dampers, and overall vehicle behavior. These are the fundamentals of Race Engineering. You must study a variety of complimentary fields: Materials Science, Metallurgy, Design, FEA, Aerodynamics and AeroElasticity. Take Claude Rouelle’s Race Engineering Seminars. Learn to use data systems as a tool for Race Engineering. Learn to use the Vehicle Sim Packages out there.
After you have done all this, you will have to go to work in a Jr level formulae team as a grunt. You will have to sweep floors, change tires, change engines. To do this, you will need hands on value to them. You must be an excellent mechanic. Some sort of certification helps…you can even work for a while as a mechanic for an arrive and drive school series or race car driving school…that will give you a good idea about basic racecar setup. Being a good welder and machinist to boot will not hurt.
This MIGHT give you enough overall skills to impress a Jr. race team into giving you a shot. They will not hire you because you are an engineer. In fact, if you tell them you are an engineer…they will roll their eyes! Trust me. Don’t tell them. Show them. From that point on it will be politics and maneuvering yourself into the position of being a race engineer involved in testing and race day set up. Then you can apply what you know. Either that…or if you have a half million to million $ you want to put at risk…start your own team!
Then the rest is simple. Win and don’t stop winning. 2.0LFF, F3, GP2….then F1. In reality, it is very much like being a driver. You must win.
Oh...you should also race too. I would suggest karting at least at the regional level. It is imperitive that you are a competent race care driver yourself in order to properly communicate with drivers, and understand different driving styles, etc.
In case you are wondering where I come up with this viewpoint, I was a kart racer for many many years, and raced with many drivers who eventually made it to the highest level. Many people I raced with who are no longer drivers are still involved in motorsport in a variety of capacities. I am aquainted with a team owner in the US, that if not for the formula car mess in the US between ChampCar and IRL...would probably be an IndyCar team owner now. He currently has one of the top Formula Atlantic Teams (A little bit faster than F3...).
While he was not a trained engineer, he partnered with one, started a team, and together they pretty much followed this route. The key is WINNING. Oh yeah...this guy was also a national caliber kart racer...who even raced in Europe with TonyKart backing. VERY good driver and good businessman.
Good luck. You will need it.
In case you are wondering where I come up with this viewpoint, I was a kart racer for many many years, and raced with many drivers who eventually made it to the highest level. Many people I raced with who are no longer drivers are still involved in motorsport in a variety of capacities. I am aquainted with a team owner in the US, that if not for the formula car mess in the US between ChampCar and IRL...would probably be an IndyCar team owner now. He currently has one of the top Formula Atlantic Teams (A little bit faster than F3...).
While he was not a trained engineer, he partnered with one, started a team, and together they pretty much followed this route. The key is WINNING. Oh yeah...this guy was also a national caliber kart racer...who even raced in Europe with TonyKart backing. VERY good driver and good businessman.
Good luck. You will need it.
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