Contact US

Log In

Come Join Us!

Are you an
Engineering professional?
Join Eng-Tips Forums!
  • Talk With Other Members
  • Be Notified Of Responses
    To Your Posts
  • Keyword Search
  • One-Click Access To Your
    Favorite Forums
  • Automated Signatures
    On Your Posts
  • Best Of All, It's Free!

*Eng-Tips's functionality depends on members receiving e-mail. By joining you are opting in to receive e-mail.

Posting Guidelines

Promoting, selling, recruiting, coursework and thesis posting is forbidden.

Students Click Here

ASME B31.3 impact Jules or lateral expansions

ASME B31.3 impact Jules or lateral expansions

ASME B31.3 impact Jules or lateral expansions

I have recently had to develop some weld PQR’s on 22% duplex steel. The weld metal and HAZ was subjected to chatty V notch impact testing to minus 60 degrees Celsius. On the first weld the impact test pass with average Jules in HAZ of 90J and around 1.48mm expansion.

I’m the full repair (so welded cut and re-welded tests) the HAZ failed according to the client. The HAZ Jules were steins 30 but the lateral expansions were 0.45-0.50mm

According to ASME all steel in group 10H (duplex) impact testing should only use lateral expansion values.

If the lateral expansion is above 0.38mm how can Clint say do not comply?

RE: ASME B31.3 impact Jules or lateral expansions

He can only reject if the minimum absorbed energy was specified in the Contract. If not, its up to your company to either redo the test sample or charge the client for the rework or refuse their rejection and state that the the contract requirements (B31.3) have been met.

RE: ASME B31.3 impact Jules or lateral expansions

Thank you weldstan. I have sent them email stating the clauses in B31.3 that say lateral expansions arw the acceptance criteria and also shows that in other codes the same is mentioned for duplex steel. They already changed the scope of work by changing the impact temperatures from -50 to -60 Celsius now they are rejecting lateral expansions. As far as I am concerned this is not like R&D and they can definitely pay for all further testing.

Thanks for your time

RE: ASME B31.3 impact Jules or lateral expansions

Makes me wonder what they are up to. The last time that I checked the min design temp for these alloys was -40.

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
P.E. Metallurgy, consulting work welcomed

RE: ASME B31.3 impact Jules or lateral expansions

Hello Edstainless,

Yes according to ASME MDMT is minus 51 Celsius. I understand that with pressure reduction we can lower this temperature. However once I contacted the top two SMP companies in the city I live in, they both only had 22% duplex PQR qualified as low as minuses 57 Celsius, and no repairs.

I have passes all required testing on first PQR but on the repair PQR (weld cut and re-weld) I can achieve lateral expansion in the HAZ ranging from 0.42 to 0.58mm (B31.3 had min value of 0.38mm as acceptance) but my energy values range from 25 Jules to 30 Jules.

They reject them on the energy values but will not consider the expansions values. All these CVN testing is at minus 60 Celsius minus 76 Fahrenheit.

All other tests including ASTM A923 method C ferrite testing all passed.

This client continues to change the criteria of what they want and don’t seam to understand what they as actually asking for.

I have even suggested changing material type for such templates, to an austenetic stainless or a nickel alloy. But was told to go away.

My only other option is to say that all repairs have to be solution annulled and run a PQR that is solution annieled after welding and see if that reigned the HAZ to achieve CVN at -60 for full thickness repair welds.

I will admit the heat inputs are a tad higher then I would like the welder can only achieve as low as 1.7Kj/min for root and 1Kj/min for hot pass. I am limited as welders are very had to find here now and good welders even harder.
Also if I pay very high money get a good welding that can achieve root pass at around 0.9Kj/min and hot pass of 0.5-0.8Kj/min I then have the problem of all the welders in the shop can not achieve this.

At minus 50 Celsius I have no problems the 10 degrees seams to make a big difference and the client is not budging at the moment.

Thank you all for the help. I am new very new to QA and have been working as a welder for 13 years so you help from this site is Fantastic in pointing me to the right clauses in the codes/ standards to look at.

Red Flag This Post

Please let us know here why this post is inappropriate. Reasons such as off-topic, duplicates, flames, illegal, vulgar, or students posting their homework.

Red Flag Submitted

Thank you for helping keep Eng-Tips Forums free from inappropriate posts.
The Eng-Tips staff will check this out and take appropriate action.

Reply To This Thread

Posting in the Eng-Tips forums is a member-only feature.

Click Here to join Eng-Tips and talk with other members! Already a Member? Login


Low-Volume Rapid Injection Molding With 3D Printed Molds
Learn methods and guidelines for using stereolithography (SLA) 3D printed molds in the injection molding process to lower costs and lead time. Discover how this hybrid manufacturing process enables on-demand mold fabrication to quickly produce small batches of thermoplastic parts. Download Now
Design for Additive Manufacturing (DfAM)
Examine how the principles of DfAM upend many of the long-standing rules around manufacturability - allowing engineers and designers to place a part’s function at the center of their design considerations. Download Now
Taking Control of Engineering Documents
This ebook covers tips for creating and managing workflows, security best practices and protection of intellectual property, Cloud vs. on-premise software solutions, CAD file management, compliance, and more. Download Now

Close Box

Join Eng-Tips® Today!

Join your peers on the Internet's largest technical engineering professional community.
It's easy to join and it's free.

Here's Why Members Love Eng-Tips Forums:

Register now while it's still free!

Already a member? Close this window and log in.

Join Us             Close