Contact US

Log In

Come Join Us!

Are you an
Engineering professional?
Join Eng-Tips Forums!
  • Talk With Other Members
  • Be Notified Of Responses
    To Your Posts
  • Keyword Search
  • One-Click Access To Your
    Favorite Forums
  • Automated Signatures
    On Your Posts
  • Best Of All, It's Free!

*Eng-Tips's functionality depends on members receiving e-mail. By joining you are opting in to receive e-mail.

Posting Guidelines

Promoting, selling, recruiting, coursework and thesis posting is forbidden.

Students Click Here

Ceramic backing factories?

Ceramic backing factories?

Ceramic backing factories?

I am in need of a ceramic backing with a particular geometry.
I have asked the known suppliers in Europe (Esab, Böhler, Lincoln, ... and some of the larger wholesellers) and none of them have anything in stock that would suit, and they do not want to disclose their supplier (I suppose they also buy it from a producer, and sell it under their name).

The quantity is likely large enough for a producer to start a batch. Does anyone known a producer of such ceramic backing strips, preferably in Europe, but I'll take anywhere) ?

Thanks in advance,

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

Google ‘ceramic welding backing,’ there are a bunch of suppliers and manufacturers.

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

Thanks for thinking along. I've been in contact with about all of the suppliers on the first two and a half pages of results, none of them had something similar as what I want in stock or as a standard product. Lots of suppliers, but not a lot of manufacturers though.
I'm awaiting answer right now from another manufacturer, they said they'll have the right person calling me back. Let's hope for the best...

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

alibaba ...?

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but they are not entitled to their own facts."

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

If ceramic doesn't pan out, maybe it'd be easier to find someone willing to make a unique copper backing bar?

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

Or change your design to work with standard products.

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

What's unique about your backing - complex curvature, intersecting weld joints, or unique cross-section of the weldment? The aluminum foil and segmented ceramic tapes (Gullco et. al.) don't work?

Dunno about Europe, but here are a list of US suppliers - https://www.thomasnet.com/products/ceramic-weld-ba...

IF those don't pan out, suggest you look for ceramics suppliers in general...or talk to a local pottery shop?

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

My experience with Cerbaco in the past was that they produceed some specially designed backers to sui tour needs.

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

@ Tug, btrueblood: We're welding heavy crane rails in situ. Think about 1" open groove.
The groove in the backing needs to be significantly wider than that, and deeper than standard because it's a heavy slag wire that needs to go somewhere.

@ sbisteel, we're seeing cracking in the bottom layers from copper pickup. We're welding slow and with high amps.
Using thicker copper bars or water cooled blocks isn't working, some of these are 100 ft in the air. And we can't lift the rails high enough to slide 'em under.

@ IM: yes, that's another option we might pursue if our current option doesn't work out: one supplier makes a proprietary geometry for another client, that would work perfectly for this application. If they can sell it to us, we're good to go.

@ Weldstan: thanks, I added Cerbaco to the list. I wasn't aware of this company.

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

Copper is useful provided you do not have direct arc impingement. That's why it works well for the electroslag process.

The problem with hard ceramic chips is that the joint needs to be very precise and consistent along its length.

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, but they are not entitled to their own facts."

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

I fully agree, however copper is in many cases the most convenient material to work with.
Here's however the result of welding on Cu (small cracks are made visible using red dye):

We've got some tolerance, but it is very much achievable using the cermaic backing.
It appears that what's in the catalog of cermaic backing factories, is about half of what they produce... They make lots of custom geometries.

RE: Ceramic backing factories?


Check out Precision Ceramics USA. https://precision-ceramics.com/
I've used them to make special ceramics of the size you are talking. They made us pieces much much bigger than you are mentioning.
Be aware ceramics of this size are sensitive to thermal shocking.

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

Thx for the info!

RE: Ceramic backing factories?

About 30 years ago, we were developing welding procedures for a very similar application. We first tried 3M ceeramic backer and then switched to those from Cerbaco which provided musch better resistance to thermal shock cracking. Tever had a problem with the root bead. Cann't say the same for welding the thin neck of the rail.

Red Flag This Post

Please let us know here why this post is inappropriate. Reasons such as off-topic, duplicates, flames, illegal, vulgar, or students posting their homework.

Red Flag Submitted

Thank you for helping keep Eng-Tips Forums free from inappropriate posts.
The Eng-Tips staff will check this out and take appropriate action.

Reply To This Thread

Posting in the Eng-Tips forums is a member-only feature.

Click Here to join Eng-Tips and talk with other members! Already a Member? Login


Low-Volume Rapid Injection Molding With 3D Printed Molds
Learn methods and guidelines for using stereolithography (SLA) 3D printed molds in the injection molding process to lower costs and lead time. Discover how this hybrid manufacturing process enables on-demand mold fabrication to quickly produce small batches of thermoplastic parts. Download Now
Design for Additive Manufacturing (DfAM)
Examine how the principles of DfAM upend many of the long-standing rules around manufacturability - allowing engineers and designers to place a part’s function at the center of their design considerations. Download Now
Taking Control of Engineering Documents
This ebook covers tips for creating and managing workflows, security best practices and protection of intellectual property, Cloud vs. on-premise software solutions, CAD file management, compliance, and more. Download Now

Close Box

Join Eng-Tips® Today!

Join your peers on the Internet's largest technical engineering professional community.
It's easy to join and it's free.

Here's Why Members Love Eng-Tips Forums:

Register now while it's still free!

Already a member? Close this window and log in.

Join Us             Close