Lloyds of London will insure pracitally anything or anybody.

Also check into "homesteading" you house -[they have that in Massachusetts USA, maybe elsewhere too?] it's a standard form that you get notarized & filed with your deed - costs ~$10.

Basically if you get sued for anything, they can't kick you out of your house to pay off the judgement.  [though it may restrict your ability to get loans & 2nd mortgages]

Here is a list of companies that write Professional Liababilty Insurance

ACE USA
Robert Cunningham
140 Broadway, 40th Floor
New York, New York 10005
646/458-6921; fax: 646/458-6903
E-mail: robert.cunningham@ace-ina.com
www.ace-ina.com


ARCHITECTS & ENGINEERS INSURANCE COMPANY (AEIC)
Jason Peterson
4001 Kennett Pike, Suite 318
Greenville, Delaware 19807
800/437-2342 ext. 102; fax: 302/658-2387
www.aeicrrg.com


CONTINENTAL CASUALTY COMPANY (CNA INSURANCE)
Lorna Parsons
Victor O. Schinnerer & Company Inc.
Two Wisconsin Circle
Chevy Chase, Maryland 20815-7022
301/961-9825; fax: 301/951-5444
E-mail: parsonsl@schinnerer.com
www.schinnerer.com


DPIC COMPANIES
Jack Doran
2959 Monterey-Salinas Highway
Monterey, California 93940
800/227-4284 ext. 264; fax: 831/649-3958
E-mail: jack_doran@rsausa.com
www.dpic.com


ECS, an XL CAPITAL COMPANY
Debra Wiechardt
520 Eagleview Boulevard, P.O. Box 636
Exton, Pennsylvania 19341-0636
800/327-1414 ext. 2654; fax: 610/458-8667
E-mail: wiechard@ecsinc.com
www.ecsinc.com



EUCLID MANAGERS
Brian Van Cleave
373 Oak Lawn Avenue, Suite 200
Elmhurst, Illinois 60173
630/833-1120 ext. 443; fax: 630/758-0100
E-mail: bvancleave@euclidmanagers.com
www.euclidmanagers.com



GE-WESTPORT INSURANCE CORPORATION
Paul Keltner
601 S. Figueroa, Suite 4390
Los Angeles, California 90017-5748
213/439-5676; fax: 213/439-5680
E-mail: paul.keltner@ercgroup.com
www.ercgroup.com


GULF INSURANCE GROUP, A MEMBER OF CITIGROUP
William Gallagher
Benchmark Professional Insurance Services Inc.
125 Broad Street
New York, New York 10004
212/291-3109; fax: 212/291-3018
E-mail: wgallagher@gulfins.com
www.gulfinsurance.com


THE HARTFORD
Dina Santomarco
77 Water Street
New York, New York 10005
212/858-5077; fax: 212/858-4898
www.thehartford.com


INTERSTATE INSURANCE GROUP (IIG)
Greg Schrom
55 East Monroe Street, Suite 3300
Chicago, Illinois 60603
312/456-7854; fax: 312/977-0828
E-mail: gschrom@iigroup.com
www.firemansfund.com/interstate/

KEMPER INSURANCE COMPANIES
Homer Sandridge
8830 Stanford Boulevard., Suite 200
Columbia, Maryland 20145
410/872-8140; fax: 410/872-8180
E-mail: hsandrid@kemperinsurance.com
www.kemperinsurance.com


LEXINGTON INSURANCE COMPANY (AIG)
Patrick McCarthy
200 State Street
Boston, Massachusetts 02109
617/330-8266; fax: 617/439-9794
E-mail: pat.mccarthy@aig.com
www.aig.com



LLOYD'S-AVRECO
Linda Deiss
AVRECO Inc.
10 South La Salle Street, 12th Floor
Chicago, Illinois 60603-1099
312/922-7563; fax: 312/803-2170
E-mail: ldeiss@avreco.mutrisk.com


LLOYD'S OF LONDON
John Kelb
Illinois R.B. Jones Inc.
220 Kaufman Financial Center
30833 Northwestern Highway
Farmington Hills, Michigan 48334
888/957-0505 or 248/538-1379 Fax: 248/538-1385
E-mail: john.kelb@illinoisrbjones.com
www.illinoisrbjones.com


PARAGON INTERNATIONAL INSURANCE BROKERS LTD.
Stefan Hibbett
7 Bishopsgate
London, England EC2N 3BX
020/7920-0365; fax: 020/7920-0365
E-mail: sfhibbett@ paragonbrokers.com
www.paragonbrokers.com


RA&MCO INSURANCE SERVICES
Grant Weaver Jr.
2300 Clayton Road, Suite 600
Concord, California 94520-2142
800/685-1600; fax: 925/685-1750
E-mail: gweaver@ramco-ins.com
www.ramco-ins.com



SAFECO INSURANCE COMPANY
Insight Insurance Services Inc.
Michelle Duffett
2000 South Batavia Avenue, Suite 300
Geneva, Illinois 60134
800/447-4626 ext. 122 Fax: 630/208-7550
E-mail: mduffett@ insightinsurance.com
www.insightinsurance.com


ZURICH NORTH AMERICA
Ron Anderson
550 West Washington, Suite 1200
Chicago, Illinois 60661
312/496-9633; fax: 312/496-9635
E-mail: ron.anderson@zurichna.com
www.zurichna.com


Look at group professional liability insurance, several professional organizations such as ASCE offer it to their members.

The prof. liability insurance is not cheap. It is essential in dealing with the public.

However,if you are providing services to large companies that maintain their own engineering staff, the issue of liability is often dealt with contractually.

Be sure to identify the actual need before you committ to buying it.

My own experience was that the request for liability insurance dealt only with damage resulting from my physical presence on the job-site, not product or professional liability. Failure to identify the insurance specifics clearly and in detail would have prevented a lot of un-necessary confusion.

 

Expect to pay 10% of your fees as a starting point on the insurance.  It will then go up each year you are in business until it is about 25% of your annual fees.

Been there done that.

Another point...

One poster noted several companies.  They probably will not touch you due to what they call an experience rating.  It has nothing to do with you, rather it is what their experience is with that industry.  Try and find an insurance agent/broker you trust to do the leg work and find an underwritter to do the policy.

Many sole practioners in Australia have been refused PI insurance by their brokers and insurance companies. Apparently its too risky for the insurers and they dont want the business anymore.

This has all come about after September 11 and Bali and the crash on the stockmarket.

Sharing knowledge is a way to immortality

Thank you all for your help.
It appears it is not as easy as I thought
to obtain PLI. I am presently looking into
the American Society of Mechanical Engineers (ASME)
as a possible source.
I wonder what everyone else out there is doing.
From what I can see it seems most small consulting
firms wing it with no insurance.

Erie Shore Consulting Engineers, Inc.
http://esce.freeservers.com

I am waiting for quotes on Professional Liability Insurance and the percentages listed above are scaring the heck out of me.  Is it typical for PLI to cost 10 to 25% of billing fees?

esce,

The post that mentioned "contractural agreement" said it all....

Remember that any USA Contract firm that hires and assigns "temps" or "contractors" typically does NOT carry professional liability insurance covering thier employees. (most contract firms do carry "general liability" insurace)

The agreement that they have with the client states that they are essentially providing "manpower" and take no responsibility for consequential damages caused by errors made by these "temps".

Apparently, this type of agreement seems to insulate the contract firms from lawsuits......there certainly are plenty of them out there

My opinion only,


MJC

  

We are an ASME fabricator and the problem is the same for us as for the cosulting industry. Our conclusion is that you have to find a broker who works with an insurance underwriter who understands your business. Most brokers only have access to a limited number of underwiters and try to fit you with one of those, just to make the sale. If the underwiter does not clearly understand your business then they will be scared away, quote a ridicuously high rate, or possibly sell you coverage that will not give you the protection you need. You will only get the right coverage and price if you deal with an underwiter who understands your business. When you contact any brokers or underwriters then question them about their experience in your specific industry. This is an age old problem and it is our impression that many fabricators and small consultants are not properly insured.

I posted a question in the Electrical activities area and received a response that led me to http://www.xldp.com which specializes in professional liability insurance for engineers, architects, and environmental people.  I have yet to talk with an agent of their company but at least it's a good lead.  The website also has a library about risk management and mitigation.

CNA is first class, I think the best in professional liability insurance.  However, if you are a sole practitioner, the best deal will be through your professional society.  Professional liability insurance should generally be less than 5% of fee income.  Of course, if you only do $2,000 in business for a year, and the minimum policy is $2,000, then it would be 100%.  But for a real consulting business, 10-25% would be very high.