×
INTELLIGENT WORK FORUMS
FOR ENGINEERING PROFESSIONALS

Contact US

Log In

Come Join Us!

Are you an
Engineering professional?
Join Eng-Tips Forums!
  • Talk With Other Members
  • Be Notified Of Responses
    To Your Posts
  • Keyword Search
  • One-Click Access To Your
    Favorite Forums
  • Automated Signatures
    On Your Posts
  • Best Of All, It's Free!

*Eng-Tips's functionality depends on members receiving e-mail. By joining you are opting in to receive e-mail.

Posting Guidelines

Promoting, selling, recruiting, coursework and thesis posting is forbidden.

Students Click Here

"Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

"Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

"Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

(OP)
What does the statement mean to you?

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

(OP)
When I look the word "positive" up, I see definitions that look qualitative or quantitative. In the above example, the two definitions don't align (given IRstuff's assumption) making the statement ambiguous. Suggest instead "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental health. Do you agree?

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

As part of our drug testing program, some volunteers accepted to experience mental illness by being administered special molecules.
The effect will last for 24 h and is completely reversible.
Moreover exercise can has positive effect on mental illness so it will be applied as part of the protocol.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

"Exercise can have a positive effect on mental health. Do you agree?

my answer is yes

luismarques

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Then "Exercise can have a negative effect on mental illness."?

"Exercise can have a positive effect on mental wellness."

Ted

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Nevertheless, if we consider "positive"/health and "illness" mathematically as greater than zero and less than zero, respectively, and that exercise moves the needle to the right, the original statement makes sense.

TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

I think in this context most people would interpret the word "positive" to mean "beneficial" (and lest we test the limits of interpretation, I mean beneficial to the excercizer, not to the illness).

But engineers aren't most people!

=====================================
(2B)+(2B)' ?

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

I see the statement as a conclusion to finding an answer to a question, "What effect does exercise have on someone with mental illness?" Without knowing the question, we attempt to interpret the conclusion statement. Would the statement be differntly interpreted if the question was "How is mental illness affected by exercise?"

Ted

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

I don't think that someone would answer that second question that way; it would be more like "Exercise alleviates (or worsens) mental illness." Certainly, this wording ought to be unambiguous, but I never thought the original phrase was particularly ambiguous.

TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

"Exercise can have a negative effect on mental illness."?

my answer is yes.

I have not a psico medical knowledge of this subject but I understand that in some cases can be beneficial to the mind the physical exercise, however I also agree that in other cases it can do worse than better. I am open mind about this subject.


luis marques

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

stevenal,

I agree the sentence is sloppily written, but context is important. A previous sentence can clarify what a positive effect is.

Quote (me?)


I have $40K worth of Xanax here in stock. Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness.

--
JHG

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

"Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."



The word "can" is my problem.

So it has the ability? But it may not? It "can" but it may or may not.

My correction:

Exercise has a positive effect on mental illness.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

The meaning of the original sentence is obvious, even if the sentence construction is clumsy.

English has a lot of examples of things that are not logical. Why do the words 'regardless' and 'irregardless' mean the same thing?

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

As George Carlin liked to point out: "You don't take a s***, you really should LEAVE a s***. If you take one, where will you keep it?" English is a big mess.

@stevenal,
"Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."
try negating both...
"Exercise can have a negative effect on mental health." Doesn't work.

A well formed expression should be true if its full negation is true.

"I find that the harder I work, the more luck I seem to have." -Thomas Jefferson
"I find that the less I work, the less luck I seem to have." makes sense
"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." -- Hanlon's Razor
"Never attribute to kindness that which is adequately explained by wisdom." OK but not helpful
"It's possible to aim low and miss." --Bran Ferren, engineer and inventor
"It's possible to aim high and hit." somehow not as inspiring

www.sparweb.ca

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

SparWeb: I don't believe that English is a big mess, it's all in the interpretation of what has been presented, I think hokie66 has the answer, it's clear. maybe a little clumsy maybe not - I would think that if the writer considered exercise to be detremental they would have used negative in place of positive.

It is a capital mistake to theorise before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. (Sherlock Holmes - A Scandal in Bohemia.)

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

"Exercise can have a negative effect on mental health."

Not clear that it's the "correct" negation

"Not exercising can have a negative effect on mental illness"

There, equally ambiguous, but arguably, making equal sense as the original.

TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

My dictionary manages to provide 28 adjectival definitions of "positive" - only two or three of which carry any real sense of increase or of being greater than zero.

I suspect too much maths has turned us into a crowd of tetchy techies.

A.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Are you positive?

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Not been tested yet.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

After thinking about this some more, I'm sticking with my initial answer.

Yes, there are two general definitions of positive: one is synonymous with beneficial; the other is mathematical (a number greater than zero, the right side of the number line).

BUT, I don't think it makes sense to apply that mathematical definition of positive to the non-mathematical phrase: "effect on mental illness"

In contrast if I had said "increasing effect on mental illness" or "multiplying effect on mental illness" etc we might conclude that there is more mental illness.
But positive doesn't mean increasing or multiplying. It means either beneficial (which makes sense in this context) or greater than zero (which does not make sense to me in this context).

At least that's the way I'm thinking about it at the moment, always open to hearing the other side.

Quote:

Suggest instead "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental health
I have no objection to that wording, either.


=====================================
(2B)+(2B)' ?

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

electricpete, in full agreement.

It is a capital mistake to theorise before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. (Sherlock Holmes - A Scandal in Bohemia.)

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

mental illness is not easy to deal with. You need to be mental ill to answer that question!
As a full my answer is yes! As a rational I do not know.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

I suspect that this may fall into the same category as the OP's concern with how his original 'question' could be interpreted:



John R. Baker, P.E. (ret)
EX-Product 'Evangelist'
Irvine, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

The secret of life is not finding someone to live with
It's finding someone you can't live without

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

John: similar to the the many questions you often get asked
Such as - "can I open the door?" when you should ask, "may I open the door?" - "would you mind if I open the door?"
It's all in the intent.

It is a capital mistake to theorise before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts. (Sherlock Holmes - A Scandal in Bohemia.)

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Yes, we have no bananas.

Ted

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Quote:

Why do the words 'regardless' and 'irregardless' mean the same thing?

Because 'irregardless' is not a word. It's a sound that ignorant people make when they should be saying the word 'regardless' or 'irrespective'.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Don't get me started on all of those George Carlin bits about the English language winky smile

John R. Baker, P.E. (ret)
EX-Product 'Evangelist'
Irvine, CA
Siemens PLM:
UG/NX Museum:

The secret of life is not finding someone to live with
It's finding someone you can't live without

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

handleman,

What is your definition of a 'word'? 'Irregardless' is listed in most dictionaries, albeit as irregular or something like that. You don't like that word, and neither do I, but it is a word.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

When people misuse a noise long enough, it becomes listed in dictionaries as "non-standard". A few more generations of mis-use and they take the "non-standard" part off. Such is human language I suppose. But that's one I will never accept as anything but a hallmark of ignorance, even when they eventually remove the "non-standard" tag.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

handleman,
What you are describing is the difference between descriptive and prescriptive grammar.
English, unlike French, does not have a prescribed grammar, although many English speakers have tried. This is where you get absurd ideas like not splitting infinitives. Just because Latin doesn't split infinitives doesn't mean it doesn't work in English, but the early English grammarians were obsessed with Latin. English is a constantly evolving language with roots in Latin, French, and Germanic, along with many loan words from other languages. It is fairly unique in that sense. There is a fascinating podcast called The History of the English Language which describes this process.

signed,
an English major who used to be prescriptive thinking, but after more study realized that prescriptive grammar doesn't really describe the language well.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Quote:

Because 'irregardless' is not a word. It's a sound that ignorant people make when they should be saying the word 'regardless' or 'irrespective'.
Lmao. Say what you want about the intricacies of what actually constitutes a word... you gotta admit that right there is funny!

=====================================
(2B)+(2B)' ?

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

All words were noises, BEFORE.

There are words we use today that didn't exist a few generations ago. Even Facebook has a different meaning than when the word was originally used

TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies forum1529: Translation Assistance for Engineers Entire Forum list http://www.eng-tips.com/forumlist.cfm

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

The exercise of reading this thread is affecting my mental health.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

...and having a deleterious effect on my affect.

A.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Quote:

All words were noises, BEFORE.

There are words we use today that didn't exist a few generations ago. Even Facebook has a different meaning than when the word was originally used

Of course. Life changes, and often language must evolve to describe it. However, the changes that irk me are the ones that are rooted in ignorance and misuse. Email exists now, it's logical to have a word for it. However, absolutely nothing changed about the world to make "irregardless" a word. Its etymology is nothing more than misapplication of a negating prefix to the proper word. Decades of ignorant misuse have forced dictionaries to acknowledge its existence, its very presence is a verbal pockmark on our cultural visage. Not that we don't have much worse ones....

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

The exercise of precriptivism will not have a positive effect on your mental health.

Jay Maechtlen
http://www.laserpubs.com/techcomm

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

Thanks, Jay. I come here for new words, and that's a new one on me. But I disagree with your conclusion. Prescriptivism can be a form of mental gymnastics, thus positive.

RE: "Exercise can have a positive effect on mental illness."

English doesn't have rules. English only has habits.
It started as an amalgamation of about 4 languages that evolved mostly separately on the British Isles, then got intermingled, then the Danish invaded and occupied (several times), then later the French took over for a while, all leaving an indelible stamp on the language until the original Anglo-Saxon is almost completely unrecognizable. And that was all hundreds of years before English-speakers started spreading all over the world.

To be, he is, they are, I am. All the same verb, but each has a different historical root.
To go, he went, they went, I went. The infinitive is unrelated to the conjugated verb.
To have, he has, they have, I have. Arbitrary use of plural/singular conjugation.

"deprecated" is a word we know. "precated" is not.
"imperfect" is the opposite of "perfect", but what's the opposite of "impetuous" or "imminent"?

Stop giving people a hard time for not getting the rules straight. There aren't any rules. If you want a language with nearly perfect rules, speak Esperanto, or Loglan. Or try Klingon.

www.sparweb.ca

Red Flag This Post

Please let us know here why this post is inappropriate. Reasons such as off-topic, duplicates, flames, illegal, vulgar, or students posting their homework.

Red Flag Submitted

Thank you for helping keep Eng-Tips Forums free from inappropriate posts.
The Eng-Tips staff will check this out and take appropriate action.

Reply To This Thread

Posting in the Eng-Tips forums is a member-only feature.

Click Here to join Eng-Tips and talk with other members! Already a Member? Login


Resources

Low-Volume Rapid Injection Molding With 3D Printed Molds
Learn methods and guidelines for using stereolithography (SLA) 3D printed molds in the injection molding process to lower costs and lead time. Discover how this hybrid manufacturing process enables on-demand mold fabrication to quickly produce small batches of thermoplastic parts. Download Now
Design for Additive Manufacturing (DfAM)
Examine how the principles of DfAM upend many of the long-standing rules around manufacturability - allowing engineers and designers to place a part’s function at the center of their design considerations. Download Now
Taking Control of Engineering Documents
This ebook covers tips for creating and managing workflows, security best practices and protection of intellectual property, Cloud vs. on-premise software solutions, CAD file management, compliance, and more. Download Now

Close Box

Join Eng-Tips® Today!

Join your peers on the Internet's largest technical engineering professional community.
It's easy to join and it's free.

Here's Why Members Love Eng-Tips Forums:

Register now while it's still free!

Already a member? Close this window and log in.

Join Us             Close