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Building Elevation Label

Building Elevation Label

Building Elevation Label

(OP)
In a process plant, where plant north seldom lines up with true north, how would you label the plant north side of a building or process structure elevation, "Plant North Elevation" or just "North Elevation"? For some reason, I think "Plant North Elevation" sounds funny, but I guess it's more technically correct.

RE: Building Elevation Label

I don't know that readers would understand that "plant" is meant as an adjective (describing "north").

"North-ish Elevation" is more accurate (than "North elevation") but way funnier !

"North Elevation" should not be IMHO too confusing or misrepresentative.

another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?

RE: Building Elevation Label

I think it depends on how far off it is from true north. If it is actually a NE side, then call it the NE side. If it is the NNE side then I would just call it the north side, and if it an ENE side then I would just call it the east side. Just add a note or something like the declination on a topo map to demonstrate the difference between true north and map/site north.

RE: Building Elevation Label

Dozer,
Try not to make it more difficult than it needs to be.
Some where on every project there is (or should be) a document that is the "Genesis" document as far as the orientation of the job site and the outside world. This document is often called the "Site Plan".
This document will (or should) show the total property shape and the survey readings for the property. It should also indicate important landmarks outside the property that may be of importance to the overall project.
The drawing will (or should) also include two specific but different symbols. One symbol for the orientation of the Project/Plant relative to North and one for the Prevailing Wind.
The Symbol for the North Orientation should have arrows that point to: True North (pointing to the North Pole), Magnetic North, Plant North and (where appropriate) Mecca.
http://www.fraw.org.uk/mei/archive/handouts/o-seri...

Once PLANT NORTH is established (for the Project) then Plant North is the only North. Period!
Plant North is then the only North that is to be shown on all other Drawings.

The Symbol for the Prevailing Wind is most often called a "Wind Rose". This Symbol will look very much like a flower . It will have concentric rings that indicate wind direction percentage and branches to indicate Wind direction and velocity.
https://www.google.com/search?q=wind+rose+diagram&...

It is also important to understand the nomenclature used when describing views.
Most of the documents that use the term "Elevation" when describing the view of an object or building (North Elevation) are Architectural Drawings. They mean they are looking at the North side of the Building (It is the North Elevation of the Building).
https://www.google.com/search?source=hp&ei=-AK...

In Mechanical Drawings the term used is "Section" as in Section A-A. You muse look at the Plan View of the object to understand where Section A-A is.
https://www.google.com/search?ei=LgOQW6yABYj0zgLk8...

I hope this will be helpful.

Sometimes its possible to do all the right things and still get bad results

RE: Building Elevation Label

Site North worked very well on one large project. And only occasionally showing "True North" as well. About 13 degree differential on that job.

RE: Building Elevation Label

Every large construction job I've been on had at least one site map/overview drawing that used either "Plant North" or "Project North" nomenclature.

RE: Building Elevation Label

(OP)
Thanks for the replies. Rb1957, you hit upon why plant north elevation sounds funny to me. Plant is usually a noun but in this case it's an adjective. Pennpiper, I like your assertion that once plant north is defined then that is north. Not sure if everyone in the universe follows that logic but I'll buy it.

BTW, I was just asking which would make more sense, "Plant North Elevation" or "North Elevation". I fully understand and embrace the concept of a plant north. Someone had marked up one of our drawings and "Plant North Elevation" sounded kind of funny to me though I completely understand what is meant. Personally, I prefer sections or using column lines to indicate an elevation and leave <compass direction> Elevation to the architects.

RE: Building Elevation Label

Sounding funny still trumps the possibility of someone making an error. Personally, I'd rather see it left in.

RE: Building Elevation Label

(OP)
Mr168, I think you meant the possibility of someone making an error trumps sounding funny.

RE: Building Elevation Label

If Plant North is defined on a drawing, and this is the primary "North" (as according to some posts above) then "North Elevation" should be clear.

What is the problem is someone misinterprets this as the true north face ? I mean are they going to align a compass to it and then get lost somewhere ?

another day in paradise, or is paradise one day closer ?

RE: Building Elevation Label

When I learned drafting back when dinosaurs still roamed the earth, we used Architectural Graphic Standards. The north arrow was placed to magnetic north as opposed to true north because if someone was going to check it, they would use a compass without making the adjustment to true north that points to the geodetic north pole.

And if you needed to rotate the plan and establish an artificial north, it was called PLAN NORTH because it is shown on a PLAN VIEW. Who started this "plant view" anyway?

North was always toward the top of the sheet. If the building was long in the north-south axis, then you could rotate your north arrow to the right side of the paper. In very rare instances, you could put north toward the bottom, but never, ever to the left. I have a feeling that last part was more American Bridge and Iron Standard where I did most of my drafting.

Putting an entrance to the building or site always at the bottom of the sheet so that the sheet is automatically oriented in the direction you would walk into the building or through the site is strictly for a non-professional user, and presumably spacial-cognitively deficient viewer, like your site plans for Disney Land and such. You would expect a site plan with the entrance always to the bottom to also have little cartoons to show you the "you are here" spot and maybe little cartoon drawings of cars to know where to find the parking lot.

Don't get me started on naming interior elevations. I've had that argument way too many times.

If you are offended by the things I say, imagine the stuff I hold back.

RE: Building Elevation Label

This is a Marijuana Plant, so it's Plant north.

Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA)


RE: Building Elevation Label

Agree with pennpiper. You define north and that's it. Then elevations are North Elevation, West Elevation, etc., except where some elevations may be at angles to the defined grid, then you can use Southeast Elevation or whatever for the non-orthogonal views.

RE: Building Elevation Label

I like having a compass rose that shows project north, true north and or magnetic north in the title block of all civil drawings.

Make project north the larger arrow and then always refer to project north as “North” and if necessary use “True North” or “Magnetic North” for clarity.

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