I believe I came off the wrong way; entirely my fault. Again, feel free to disagree with me.
I'm not saying that nickling and dimeing someone is wrong; rather that it's use shouldn't be applied to everyone as a default in my opinion. As MacGyver said (and I did as well):
Dan said:
Make it a rule, and if the person at the other end doesn't abuse it, don't add the charge to the invoice. If they do abuse it, they've been notified of the charge ahead of time.
Forgive me if I address some other points in detail. Not trying to personally attack anyone here but it sounds like you got the impression I was; just trying to debate.
Pam said:
If you want to imply that I am unethical and/or not a team player, you need to think again.
I didn't think I implied unethical behavior but if I did I apologize; that was not my intent.
Team player was the intent, though I was apparently more aggressive than I intended. Again, with the caveat that my original point was I don't feel it's in the spirit of "team player" to nickle and dime everyone as a default.
You reference lawyers a lot. Nobody wants to talk to a lawyer for many reasons, but nickle and dimeing is one. The result is people will try to cut corners when they think they can if it avoids another 15 minute bill at a lawyers rate. Thus, lawyers become a (un)necessary evil in any endeavor involving them. I don't personally feel that we should emulate that practice as engineers.
Pam said:
Time is money. Sometimes Clients will nickel and dime engineering firms to death.
I'm not saying we should bend over backwards for someone who will happily walk all over us. Quite the opposite; I'm a firm believer in a fair price for our work as engineers. We can and should utilize contract language that lets us cover and prevent someone who seeks to take advantage of us. Simply my opinion is that this shouldn't be the default for those who are not trying to nickle and dime a firm to death (either intentionally or otherwise).
Dan said:
not to mention making me lose track of what I was currently working on.
This is definitely why I qualified that my experience may differ. The consulting jobs for industry and especially the precast work requires me to be able to bounce from many different projects in a day. I fully agree it costs efficiency but as it's my day-to-day work I forget that this isn't typical.
However, this is why we have voicemail, email, etc. To put tasks on hold while we get to a good stopping place.
Pam said:
If I'd made a mistake on space for "hooks in a rebar cage," I would investigate the situation to determine how to handle it.
You're right, bad example. I would hope that most engineers are willing to deal with a problem that they share fault in at no cost. I know this isn't always the case with some less ethical engineer but I unintentionally implied that a fine billing practice equated with such poor ethics. Not my intent.
Dan said:
I'm surprised you don't see the other side of the coin...
Perhaps it's because I'm often on both sides of the coin simultaneously that I felt it merited playing devils advocate here. I often find myself as intermediary between EOR and contractor. So, it's not that I don't see the other side of the coin but that perhaps I was concerned that each side of the coin wasn't being fully considered.
Pam said:
I would appreciate the same consideration.
It would be unethical for me to do otherwise, hopefully I've explained my position adequately. For emphasis, please disagree with me. I'll happily say I agree or disagree but I don't feel this is an instance where only one answer can be the right one.
Professional Engineer (ME, NH, MA) Structural Engineer (IL)
American Concrete Industries