nlpm
Chemical
- Jun 17, 2005
- 38
I search for software help me in Multiphase pipeline design
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multiphase pipline
- Thread starter nlpm
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bulkhandling
Mechanical
What is the Multiphase? Solids + liquid? solids + gas? or liquid + gas?
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I did some serious research in this area a few years ago. It is really "fun" to read a 300 page doctoral dissertation and reach the conclusion that the "new" method presented in the paper "matched measured data almost 50% of the time." I saw similar statements in several papers that were approved by theses committees. I could do just as well with a coin toss.
The problem with predicting multiphase flow (liquid and gas, or liquid, gas, and solid, it doesn't matter) is that any given "steady state" has a duration of fractions of a second and fractions of a meter. You never see pure bubble flow or pure wavy flow for more than miliseconds. It is enlightening to look at some of the flow visualization work that has been done by Welker, the exact same input conditions will produce widely differing flow regimes every snapshot in every run.
Of course, the flow regime is some sort of function of flow energy (maybe with a secondary function of the position of Mars in Aquarius), but every learned paper that I've ever seen that tries to predict flow regime based on temperature, pressure, velocity, pipe angle, or day of the week has failed to produce repeatable results.
My approach to the original question is to use the AGA equation, tempered with the Duckler correlation as modified by the Flanigan method for inclined sections--take the result into Excel and adjust it with a random number generator.
David
The problem with predicting multiphase flow (liquid and gas, or liquid, gas, and solid, it doesn't matter) is that any given "steady state" has a duration of fractions of a second and fractions of a meter. You never see pure bubble flow or pure wavy flow for more than miliseconds. It is enlightening to look at some of the flow visualization work that has been done by Welker, the exact same input conditions will produce widely differing flow regimes every snapshot in every run.
Of course, the flow regime is some sort of function of flow energy (maybe with a secondary function of the position of Mars in Aquarius), but every learned paper that I've ever seen that tries to predict flow regime based on temperature, pressure, velocity, pipe angle, or day of the week has failed to produce repeatable results.
My approach to the original question is to use the AGA equation, tempered with the Duckler correlation as modified by the Flanigan method for inclined sections--take the result into Excel and adjust it with a random number generator.
David
- Thread starter
- #5
I was working on my Masters Theses (on a tangentially related topic) and mostly used inter-library loans to get the documentation. It is amazing how much of it (in 1993) was simply graphs from an FEA run with minimal experimental data to confirm what the robot told them.
Bob Welker founder of Welker Engineering used to do a class at the International School of Hydrocarbon Measurement (ISHM) in Oklahoma City on flow visualization that was really informative, I haven't been to ISHM in a few years and I don't know if he's still doing it. The web page for Welker Engineering is all about the company and their commercial products.
There is some good basic data in the GPSA Engineering Data books. Beyond that I've been scrounging bits and pieces of data for years--none of it is in any organized place. Sorry.
My guess (closer to a WAG than a SWAG) is that each sector on the flow-regime map is associated with a specific instantenous energy available in each of the forms that energy can take, but I don't know how or which form dominates at any given milisecond. I've seen that annular flow, wavy flow, or stratified flow tend to be absent from the area around an elbow--I'm thinking that the local velocities associated with the high angular acceleration have something to do with pushing the fluid into slug flow, but I don't have any arithmetic to confirm it.
Maybe someone else has a reference that doesn't have to be taken with a large dose of salt.
David
David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.
The harder I work, the luckier I seem
Bob Welker founder of Welker Engineering used to do a class at the International School of Hydrocarbon Measurement (ISHM) in Oklahoma City on flow visualization that was really informative, I haven't been to ISHM in a few years and I don't know if he's still doing it. The web page for Welker Engineering is all about the company and their commercial products.
There is some good basic data in the GPSA Engineering Data books. Beyond that I've been scrounging bits and pieces of data for years--none of it is in any organized place. Sorry.
My guess (closer to a WAG than a SWAG) is that each sector on the flow-regime map is associated with a specific instantenous energy available in each of the forms that energy can take, but I don't know how or which form dominates at any given milisecond. I've seen that annular flow, wavy flow, or stratified flow tend to be absent from the area around an elbow--I'm thinking that the local velocities associated with the high angular acceleration have something to do with pushing the fluid into slug flow, but I don't have any arithmetic to confirm it.
Maybe someone else has a reference that doesn't have to be taken with a large dose of salt.
David
David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.
The harder I work, the luckier I seem
MikeHalloran
Mechanical
See "The Flow of Complex Mixtures in Pipes", Govier/Aziz.
The book has been helpful to me in understanding, if not predicting, multiphase flows in boat exhausts.
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
The book has been helpful to me in understanding, if not predicting, multiphase flows in boat exhausts.
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
nlpm:
In Europe the "wavw" is OLGA. This software is sold by Scandpower. Check out:
But its absolutely NOT free (and very expensive). I dont know about licenses for educational insitutions?
Best regards
Morten
In Europe the "wavw" is OLGA. This software is sold by Scandpower. Check out:
But its absolutely NOT free (and very expensive). I dont know about licenses for educational insitutions?
Best regards
Morten
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