Manufacturing drawings have different part and drawing number! 1

[var10]

Hi

We are a fairly new company when it comes to manufacturing. Like any company design and drafting side of things are a bit messy because we are still developing. We have been improvising along but still running into loops and seems like a never ending issue. We are in aerospace industry and CASA and other aviation standards are the reason why I have done what I am about to explain.

The drawing has information on how to manufacture, conversion coat, masking and paint info and assembly instructions. So the manufacture stage part no is for example - 123-987A-00, conversion coat stage part no is 123-987B-00, and most probably final stages will be painting whose part no is 123-987-00 (without an alphabet). We don't have one supplier who can do all processes at their workshop. Which means that each stage is done by different person and they have to be inspected in-house before we send it to the next person. So we need to receive it in somehow and do inspections and send them out as "B" - receive them again and send them again as "C" or final part number. I am fine with all this, but people in the other end always tend to make errors when they supply conformance certificates and FAI reports. They usually give it to us with the final part no. I have a table with all part process nos in the front page of my drawing and yet these mistakes happen.

I know it is not our fault and they should be more careful. Reason why i am considering changing is so that I don't have to ring them every time they have stuffed up and ask another one. Probably some one had similar issues or someone knows a way around this to better track parts! Any ideas and suggestions will be very much appreciated.
PS: Everything needs to be traceable.
Thanks,
V.

 

[ajack1]

The system sounds fine to me, but a bit of training might help.

 

[drawoh]

var10,

Your numbering system makes sense to me. If I worked there, I could send your part 123-987A-00 out for an anodize finish as part 123-987C-00. Your numbering system explicitly shows that the two resulting parts have the same substrate.

Are the "people at the other end" your people, or your vendors?

It sounds like you have a training and communication problem.

--
JHG

 

[var10]

The other end people are mostly our suppliers (sometimes it is internal when masking and assembling). They always tend to get it wrong because they look at the drawing sheet that they are working on and write the number found there (which is usually the final part no). The process numbers are found on the front page and suppliers fail to see it.

If I did put the process number as part numbers then I would have many separate drawings for the same part. (which will be too hard, too much and too confusing to manage).

I could provide training to people in our assembling unit and don't see any issues here, but suppliers?

 

[MikeHalloran]

Given the ability of modern CAD systems to work with layers, I don't see why you can't send to each vendor a drawing showing exactly what they are to supply, and even another drawing showing exactly what will be sent to them, with each having a unique identifier that no one has to interpret, and from which no one has to extract a partial part number so as to fill out your paperwork to your satisfaction.

Training vendors' staff comes with several problems:
-Only the most senior of them will be allowed to participate. They will usually not be the ones doing the actual work. You will be relying on their training skills to train the actual workers. They have no training skills. They have no budget for training. They have no interest in training. They have no interest in helping you succeed.
-Next week's crop of rent-a-bums will need to be trained all over again, but you won't find out that the population has changed until they screw up your stuff yet another time.

>>> it is not our fault and they should be more careful<<<
Wrong. It is all your fault. Your current system is optimized only to keep your phone ringing. ... and not in a good way.




Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[ctopher]

I agree with the others here. Setup the training and give everyone manuals how your system works. Also, send a reference to the manual with every contract. A lot of people these days do not understand, or care, about any type of document management. It will take some time, but you have to be persistent.

Chris
SolidWorks 11
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion

 

[swoop360]

My experience with dealing with the "shop floor" is to give them only the information they need and nothing more. If you give them more, best case they come back with questions, worst case--they guess. I have to agree with MikeHalloran, a separate drawing for each P/N with the required substrate in a bill of materials should be the least prone to mistakes (at least after the documents themselves are free of mistakes).

That said, if these subcontractors are going to be long-term partners, training could be an option, but then you'll have to start back at zero if you go somewhere else.

 

[var10]

Thanks, yes we already tried having separate drawing for each process P/N. It was a pain for people other than eng dep to understand what drawings were relevant for what processes and if there was rev what numbers had to be changed. So they changed to this system. Document control was also a major problem. Thanks again everyone! I have an idea now, I can have the master part no in every page next to process number and a table. Can control this in sheetformats in my cad package. Will give this a go!!

 

[berkshire]

This may add a layer of complexity you do not want, but on the other hand it may help.

Does your shop use route sheets or travelers with job instructions, tool numbers, and process control information in house.
Maybe you should consider sending these to your vendors with the drawings, if you do not already do so.
Point out that the drawing is the final authority, but that your planning sheets will help vendors avoid mistakes.
This of course presumes that you have a planning and methods department that can write these sheets in the first place.
B.E.


You are judged not by what you know, but by what you can do.

 

[drawoh]

var10,

One other thing occurred to me. When you do a multi-step fabrication process, do you call up the previous part on the new drawing?

For example, I fabricate part 123-456.

My paint drawing 123-455 calls up part 123-456 on a material list.

My silkscreen drawing 123-454 calls up the painted part 123-455.

My assembly calls up the silkscreened part 123-454.

How simple are your part names? If someone is working with a HANDY DANDY WIDGET POWER SUPPLY PCB MOUNT BRACKET WASHER HOLDER, they are going to give it a nickname. I guarantee this. The next person to work with it will give it a different nickname. No one will understand what anyone else is talking about. In manufacturing, anything you do to create chaos and confusion, will succeed completely.

Be merciful to people who hunt and peck, or who have to write things out by hand.

--
JHG

 

[jassco]

Hi, var10:

I'm sorry, but these issues you are facing are caused by you. The mistakes are preventable. You are supposed to send a print with 100% info (neither 99% nor 101%) that each vendor needs. You have to realize that business is about transaction. You provide a print for a service to turn item "ABC" to item "XYZ". If I were you, I would not use an intelligent part number system. But I understand that in your case you probably has no choice but to use it.

I also have very deep processes for products. But this kind of issues rarely happen to me.

Good luck!

Alex

 

[var10]

drawoh,

It is exactly the way you have explained it to me. Except we stick to one number but have various processes A,B,C and finally the P/N with no alphabet.

 

[KENAT]

What are the PO's listing to the various vendors?

Posting guidelines faq731-376

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

(probably not aimed specifically at you)
What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484​