ICC ESR Reports in submittals?

[gdubb08]

I'm trying to get some feedback on appendices for structural calculation submittal packages. I always specify something along the lines of, "Installations of X shall conform to ESR-XXXX" in my basis of design. I have always been in the habit of adding ESR reports for various items specified in calculations/details as well. This many times doubles the size of my calculation submittals. Any opinions on omitting the reports from the submittal?

 

[woodman88]

I have always gone the "Green" way and do not submit the reports with my calculations.
The building department can look them up themselves or ask me for a copy if they want to review them.

Garth Dreger PE - AZ Phoenix area
As EOR's we should take the responsibility to design our structures to support the components we allow in our design per that industry standards.

 

[dhengr]

“Structural calculation submittal packages?” What the heck are they? I thought our LEED and Eco-friendly thinking meant saving trees, not cutting more trees just to add reams of added copied materials to someone’s filing system. If the plan checker wants to learn Structural Engineering, let him/her go to an engineering school, rather than learn from studying my calcs. If he/she has a legitimate question about an unusual detail or condition and how I analyzed it, fine. But, even that gets old after a while. Who’s ultimately responsible for the job anyway? What are you going to do when you spec. something as ‘such-n-such’ or equal? Are you then expected to uncover and copy every possible ICC ESR Report which might tickle the contractors fancy, and find any ‘not equal’ conditions? Maybe we should just start copying and imparting all of mankind’s worldly knowledge of Structural Engineering with each beam connection design treatise. It just keeps getting crazier every day. If they want a copy, they know where to go to get it. Let them pay for the copying.

The AHJ has always had the right to question something new, or different, or that they didn’t understand. But, they also used to have a little faith in (respect for) the EOR’s ability, credentials, and responsibilities and obligations. We’ve already got codes which are so damn complicated and convoluted that no experienced engineer can use them efficiently. All because, in an effort to be fully democratic, any dummy should be able to do anything, if only he/she can follow a complex enough recipe. Then we have even more-dumber people looking over the engineer’s shoulder and assuming if they amass a thick enough file on the project, all will be safe and well. And, five or ten years later you can’t go back to the bldg. dept. and find a set of plans on the darn thing, for a renovation project.

 

[hokie66]

I think these type submittals are like a professor I once had (not in an engineering subject). Legend had it that he would take all the papers, throw them down a flight of stairs, and the ones that went farther got the best grades.