EOR role in contractor proposed fix 3

[dylansdad]

All,
I have searched numerous threads in eng-tips and other discussion boards, and a lot of information is out there...but nothing specifically relating to the questions I have.

Say a contractor notifies owner/EOR of something structural that was left out/overlooked (exclusively contractor error).

1. You as the EOR, is it your responsibility to design a "fix".
2. You, as the EOR, do you request the contractor to hire an engineer if not one on board to design/stamp a fix?
3. You, as the EOR, are you required to approve such "fix", and are you then liable?
Is this something that is typically spelled out in the owner/engineer contract?
thanks for all replies.

 

[ztengguy]

As the EOR I would say its up to you to design the fix, or check and approve a fix that is proposed. I would say if you approve, you become somewhat liable.

 

[jayrod12]

I agree with ztengguy, however It's only up to the EOR to design the fix if they pay him for it. When it is contractor error and not an omission from the drawings on the design end then you should not have to provide the fix for free.

 

[Archie264]

If I understand the scenario correctly then the required “fix“ has already been designed: it is the original design documents. If the contractor built something other than what was designed than that’s on him. He can either correct it per the original design or request permission from the Owner and EOR to build something different, in which case, once approval is granted, he should pay for the design.

 

[KootK]

In an ideal world, I would agree with Jayrod. You do stuff, you get paid for it. In practice, I find that is rarely the case with fixes and how I approach the issue will depend on the scale of the engineering effort involved to process the fix. Within reason, I always assume that some of my contract administration budget will go towards field fixes. Here's why:

1) For many of us, having good relationships with local contractors is an important part of our business development strategy. I always try to treat contractors as though they are a client of sorts, even when they are not paying my invoices.

2) I make mistakes too. When I do, it is often to my benefit to be working with a contractor with whom I have a good relationship. If they owe me a favour or two, all the better. I find that, if I nickel and dime contractors, they'll reciprocate. And, often, their nickels and dimes are much bigger.

3) From a liability standpoint, being the target of a successful delay claim can be as big a risk as anything else.

4) Trying to get invoices paid for small fixes will often burn up more fee than the value of the invoice.

As far as contractual stuff goes:

1) I have some catch-all stuff on my drawings which I almost never enforce.

2) I've worked on some larger jobs where we had an open time rates contract with the GC to which we billed our time for fixes. That eliminated problem #4 above. It was great but it's definitely the exception rather than the rule.

3) If the fix is delegated out of house, the liability should resign with the external engineer. That's unlikely to keep the lawyers off your back however.

The greatest trick that bond stress ever pulled was convincing the world it didn't exist.

 

[JAE]

1. You as the EOR, is it your responsibility to design a "fix".
[red] It is your responsibility to ensure public safety and welfare. Also your job to look out for the interests of your client. With that the answer is that it is your responsibility to ensure that the final structure is safe, etc.[/red]
2. You, as the EOR, do you request the contractor to hire an engineer if not one on board to design/stamp a fix?
[red] You can do that - it is your decision to do the fix or delegate it to a contractor-hired engineer and you review it/approve it[/red]
3. You, as the EOR, are you required to approve such "fix", and are you then liable?
[red] Yes, "the buck stops with you" Your job is to make sure that the proper structure is in place when all is said and done.[/red]
Is this something that is typically spelled out in the owner/engineer contract?
[red] We include a provision that all contractor/field errors are not a part of our scope of services and would be dealt with as additional services.
If you choose to delegate the fix to the contractor's engineer then you still would have time spent in reviewing the fix and approving it. Whether you bill for that is up to you and I would refer you to KootK's good comments on relations. If you choose to fix it yourself, then you would probably want to get approval of your additional services through your client (architect and owner) that you would be paid. Many times this takes the form of the owner withholding some amount of payment to the contractor to pay you for the fix. This way you still work for your clients and not for the contractor (i.e. no conflict of interest).[/red]


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[Archie264]

Goot point, Koot. Bail out the contractor on this go-round and he may return the favor in the future.

 

[manstrom]

Maybe give the contractor a "freebie" on this one.

It sets a standard for who pays for their screw ups. It also generates good will between you and the builder. Sometimes, it's better to have someone owe you a favor than send you a check.

 

[TLHS]

If you don't charge, I'd still suggest writing a little email or letter or something saying that it's going to take however many hours to resolve and that you haven't charged because of whatever reason but may have to in the future.

If you word it right and in a friendly way it does a couple of things,

-Points out that you actually are doing them some sort of favour. Some people don't realize this
-Makes it clear that you aren't setting a precedent and provides notice that you believe the cost isn't inherently yours to bear

I also do that with scope changes to clients. If there's a scope change that we decide to eat because there's existing budget left over or some other similar thing, it's good to still send them an official change notice of some sort, but with an explanation of why there's no charge

 

[msquared48]

As the EOR, you are on the hook for any changes you approve, verbally or in writing, hopefully in writing, any.

You should have the contractor recommend a fix to you in writing, with appropriate sketches, and then you analyze it and make any necessary changes prior to approval. It should be handled in the same manner as an RFI (Request For Instruction). Also, it is the responsibility of your client, whomever it is, to pay you for the extra time, as an extra service under the contract, if you have that clause inserted.

Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA)

 

[dylansdad]

Thanks for all the replies. Very helpful.