Creo parametric app demo

[solidworm]

hi everyone,
i watched the creo demo and thought i'd give what they showed a try in ProE to see if it's possible. as you see in following images, a set of 13 features that makes a nozzle is moved to other side of the part. i tried to use "edit references" but it fails. anyone wants to give it a try?
View attachment 4827

View attachment 4828

 

[zpaolo]

I can't try it right now, but it "should" work if while building the various features of the nozzle you don't reference the part body or other fixed datums. The "plus" of the Creo implementation should be the ability to do such a thing without having to "pre-plan" feature positioning and references. But as usual, doing proper and flexible referencing is part of a good, modifiable design in the first place...

Paolo

 

[r.decker]

Just curious, but if you had a UDF library of "nozzles" that attached to points wouldn't that accomplish nearly the same thing? If you had a nozzle udf constrained to a point on one surface, all you would need to do is reroute the point to appear on the new surface and the udf would move with it. I have not used udfs much myself, but I think this fuctionality is there.

 

[solidworm]

yes the functionality is here, thanks to Paolo's advice i was able to make something similar using edit references command. the only problem is the fillet that fails:
View attachment 4829

View attachment 4830

 

[CreoCadGuy]

Hi Guys,

I'm back...I had some problems with my "proecadguy" account anyway, so I was happy to re-register as "CreoCadGuy".

Anyway, I think you might be missing the point of this particular part of the Creo demonstration. Certainly there are ways with clever, feature-based parametric modeling to approximate the behavior seen in the demo.

The point, however, is that you can take any geometry, from any number of features, and move it to a completely different region of the part - even in a different orientation. This move was done in the Creo Direct Modeling App in the launch event demo. In doing this, even though we allowed the user to work directly with the geometry, we never destroyed the underlying parametric definition of the features that originally were responsible for the geometry. To emphasize this, at the end of the demo a different user who wants to work with parametric features still had the ability to edit the originally defined radial pattern that governed the number of bosses on the nozzle. Of course the number of pattern members regenerates properly in the new location.

Hope this helps.

 

[rworrell]

Hello Everybody


Last week we had people in from PTC showing the new Creo Version.We watched the creo demo and think this is going to save a lot of time. The Demo was to be on line but we haven't been able to locate it. Could someone point me in the right direction please.


Thanks

 

[solidworm]

downloadable creo demo :
http://media-dl.ptc.com/mkt/dl/creo-webcast.mov

Edited by: solidworm

 

[dgs]

The functionality they showed here would not be very easy to do in Pro/E unless the features were built with this in mind in the first place. As Brian said, this is part of the Creo Elements Direct app, not the parametric app. It's likely pretty easy to do in CoCreate now.

 

[rworrell]

Good Morning Solidworm


I'll study it as soon as I get the ECO out.


Thanks

 

[r.decker]

The functionality they showed here would not be very easy to do in Pro/E unless the features were built with this in mind in the first place. As Brian said, this is part of the Creo Elements Direct app, not the parametric app. It's likely pretty easy to do in CoCreate now.

I thought it might be there but was not sure of the ease (don't use udf's much as majority of our work is in sheetmetal). I also tend to think 15-20+ steps down the road when I begin modelling, just the way my mind works and I try to include potential variances. This causes frustration with my manager as I'm asking questions he hasn't thought of yet

.


I did see the presentation and I am very impressed with the capabilities that creo is going to have. Being a multi-cad company the abilities in creo will make our collaberation much much easier,. When we have had to share data between facilities it has always been in the form of iges or step files, with accompanying pdf drawings, and we typically end up remodelling the components from scratch in our native software. There are a couple of us here really looking forward to the release of creo and the integrated apps (is "apps" trademarked?, nm, I wander) and what it can do for our design prcess.

 

[dr_gallup]

Hi Guys,
In doing this, even though we allowed the user to work directly with the geometry, we never destroyed the underlying parametric definition of the features that originally were responsible for the geometry. To emphasize this, at the end of the demo a different user who wants to work with parametric features still had the ability to edit the originally defined radial pattern that governed the number of bosses on the nozzle. Of course the number of pattern members regenerates properly in the new location.

I haven't watched the demo (all videos are blocked at work), but I don't conceptually understand how a direct, non parametric modeler can have "parametric features still had the ability to edit the originally defined radial pattern". Sounds like you are talking out of both sides of your mouth.

 

[r.decker]

All videos are blocked where I work too (as well as downloads, and many other work-related website, but that's another story), so I had to send the link to the webcast replay to myself at home. Personally I could have done without the 2-bit marketing stage-play at the beginning, but you can skip past the annoying first 5 minutes or so. It's actually worth a look, and I will be impressed if creo is pulled off as it has been shown.


When I initially mentioned udfs, I figured the radial pattern would be created in the udf, and when you reloacted the point the nozzle would move. Yes, the fillet at the base would fail, but that could easily be rerouted as well, take maybe 5 seconds of time. In the creo demo, when the nozzle was moved in a direct model app and when reopend in parametric app a new feature in the model tree was created. Now this is just a guess on my part, but I would think that this new feature is a feature created from a reroute of references, or that's how the parametric app would see it.


Kind of grasping at straws here, but I don't get paid to figure out how it works, I just use the tools my company provides. If they have figured out how to get it to work, I can see how it will "redefine CAD for the next 20 years", but I do want to see it work first. Until then, I'll remain intrigued without holding my breath.

 

[dgs]

I'm betting the new feature is something like a move operation. Nothing much dimensionally to modify. I'm thinking if you roll the model back, the nozzle will be at the bottom and the direct feature will be a recording of it being moved. I'm hoping it will be handled in some kind of intelligent and editable way, but I'm not counting on it.

 

[Richh]

Creo Direct> back toPro.


As a user of both Pro/E and CoCreate, I have an interest in howCreo willadd aseamlessintegration betweenthe twoapplications. And I also have atheory on howCreo willaccomplish it.


With regards to moving the nozzle features. This is my view of how the dataexchange betweenDirect and Prois going tofunction ata basic,fundamental levelin a modeling scenario similar to that ofthe nozzle-edit we seein the Creodemo.


Any parametric feature(s) that arechanged in Directwill betracked with history, (similar to a trail file)and anyparent/child relationships affected bythe change(s) whilein theDirect sessionwill be groupedtogether according to their parent/child relationships.


Once the model is transfered back to the Pro side (from Direct), all of the top-levelparent feature(s) in any of the "groups" will be considered by Pro to be"packaged". By this I mean thatthe location of the changed feature(s) will be rememberedby the common data model, and berepresented correctly just as it was when it left Direct, but any of the parent feature(s) will not have a complete definition of it'snewly changedreferences. The feature(s) will exist as"packaged features" just the same as "packaged components" can exist in an assembly model.


I think this is the only way the data exchange between the two will worksuccessfullywithout inducing huge problems. The software isn't going to knowhow to pick every singlereference, half the time I have a hard time doing that myself!


If building in design intent is important to you, (which it probablyis for most parametric CAD users)I think you will have to manually go back into thechanged parent feature(s) and manually redefineat least some of their references.


It only makes sense that ifcomponents in an assemblycan be placed without references that features can alsobe made to behave in asimilar manner in a part.


What do you allthink? I am making logical assumptions here, right?

Edited by: Richh

 

[CreoCadGuy]

Hi Guys,

I like reading the theories here...great stuff from people that are really thinking about the problem quite carefully. I'm not able to talk in detail about exactly how we're doing what we're doing - you'll all find out soon enough as people get their hands on Creo 1.0 next summer.

However, to dr_gallup - no talking out of both sides of my keyboard, I promise.

 

[Richh]

Next summer? I can't wait until next summer, I'll have an ulcer if Ihave to wait that long!

My friend, I think maybe you and I shouldget together and hit the bars, like,next weekend. I'll buy. Hopefully I can handle my liquor better than you so at bar time I can weezle out of you justhow this Creo thing really works!

 

[dr_gallup]

So the parametric features were created in Pro, then it was opened in Direct, the features were moved & then it was opened in Pro again where the features were once again parametric? Is that what you're saying? Wouldn't be a lot easier to just put all the capabilities in one program? Oh, I see, then you could not charge double.

 

[zpaolo]

Wouldn't be a lot easier to just put all the capabilities in one program? Oh, I see, then you could not charge double.

All the capabilities, as far as I understood, will be in CREO Elements Pro. Maybe a user will only need to do modifications to parts, so for him the Direct app will be enough, no need to pay for a complete parameteric modeler if the only thing you have to do is revise a design. This is the fundamental idea behind all the CREO apps stuff, I think.

Paolo

 

[dgs]

As I understood it, there are two apps, direct and pro. The both open the same file, the difference is in the tools available.

Ritchh, I'm not counting on it being that good. I'm thinking the parametric model that's modified in the direct app will have features at the end of the tree that contain the edits made in the direct app. When you open it again in pro, you can accept or reject those changes, they show up in the tree in a highlighted color.

If you accept them, and then roll the model back ahead of the direct 'features', the model will exist exactly as it was before ti was opened in direct.

What they didn't show is what will the pro app see if opening a model created in direct? If you then add features in Pro, how will that change be displayed when opened in direct?

 

[zpaolo]

As I understood it, there are two apps, direct and pro. The both open the same file, the difference is in the tools available.

Maybe I'm wrong but I seem to remember that they clearly stated that Pro will have the _full_ toolset, parametric histoy based and direct modeling. It looks like that also from the buttons in the interface...