16 Hour NCEES Structural Exam

[VAStrEngr]

Other than individual pride, does anyone know what the benefit is to taking this 16 hour Structural Exam coming up next spring? Does it automatically guarentee a SE license in those states that currently license SE's seperate from PE's or do you still have to pass the state specific tests? Is it just a resume builder or do companies not even care that I went the extra step to take this?

I have taken the original Structural I in hopes of one day getting the Structural II in but I couldn't do it before this past fall so I guess I am out of luck.

What benefit can I garnish from suffering through it?

Thanks!

 

[steellion]

The intention of the new 16-hour exam is that passing the exam will earn you an SE. However, it is still up to each state to adopt this as their standard, and I don't know where that process stands.

I would wait to see it all get ironed out a bit before being a "guinea pig" for the first offering of the test. Besides, they aren't even offering the exam in my state! (my state does not have an SE designation)

 

[JAE]

Eventually states will adopt the 16 hour for structural - but for many states this might take years. There are states (Illinois) that require 16 hours of structural exams to do ANY structural design.

I would take it now - get it done. The longer you wait the harder it will be to study and pass it.

 

[slickdeals]

@JAE:
From what you have read, is there going to be any sort of "grandfathering"? Would it mean my bosses (who are 40 and 50 years old) will have to take the 16 hour exam and pass it in order to be able to be a registered in any other state?

 

[hawkaz]

I suspect the new 16-hour exam will have exactly the opposite effect than they were hoping for. They were hoping to get consistent standards for structural engineers across the country. One test fits all, including California.

By implementing this exam, we will probably have 40 states drop any efforts toward structural requirements and allow a civil registration instead (many do already anyway). We will probably have around 10 states that will use this exam. Try convincing Arkansas (no offence to any Razorbacks) that their structural engineers need to have the same testing as high seismic or high wind areas.

The original intent was to push all states to recognize structural engineering as unique and separate from Civil engineering. This will blow that out of the water.

 

[dcarr82775]

I took and passed the SE-I and SE-II exams, but have not taken any of the state specific exams for SE yet. I hope my two tests count as good as the one new test.

 

[nutte]

Dcarr, I e-mailed the Washington state board, and they said they will not be accepting the old SE-I + SE-II combination as equivalent to the 16-hour SE exam. Many states have not yet weighed in, but WA for one has.

I would expect that if you're currently licensed in a state as a civil PE, and they created an SE license, you'd be grandfathered in. This would not help you, however, if you were not previously licensed in that state and then try to become so. In that case you'd have to abide by the new rules.

 

[a2mfk]

I've never understood the one "PE" license designation. Maybe it could get complicated, but why not a separate test and license designation for (which there are already many separate tests or choices of morning/afternoon sections, at least in Florida) :

General Civil
Transportation
Geotech
Structural
Electrical
Mechanical

I took the 8-hour NCEES Structural only test to get a PE, we don't have an SE designation in Florida.

Maybe it would be something like, "PE-Mechanical" on your seal and license.

I know of too many instances where someone with a PE is practicing outside of their area of expertise. Yes I know all of the board rules regarding that and the responsibility falls on the individual, the Board is not the gastapo that follows us all around and checking all of our work...

If you have the expertise, prove it, pass the exam for that area...

Speaking of which, I just for fun (man am I lame) went to the FL Board website, and someone got an admin charge, and the Board is requiring that person, a PE, to pass the NCEES Structural Exam and pass 9 hours of college level structural engineering classes prior to practicing structural engineering again. Which is my entire point, but do it up front, not after someone gets busted.

 

[TTUengr51]

For Washington, they will offer the SE III one last time next October. So if you already have passed the SE I and SE II and need your SE in Washington, this would be an option to avoid the new 16 hour exam.

Nick Deal, PE, SE
Michael Brady Inc.

http://www.michaelbradyinc.com

 

[SteelPE]

The more they try to make things easier and more uniform, the more complicated it gets.

In my jurisdiction, my stamp is required to say PE structural... and I was required to take the Structural I exam but not the structural II. I have no idea what this means to me in the future when applying for reciprocity.

Kind of frustrating to go completely through the process and have no idea if I'm going to have to start all over again.

 

[VAStrEngr]

SteelPE, what jurisdiction are you practicing in?

Just out of curiousity, I actually emailed our state board here in Virginia to ask what was the benefit of taking the 16 hour SE exam versus just taking the general civil PE with a Structural Depth component. Shockingly, in Virginia there is no difference! The only response I got was "unless there is an industry need for an individual to pass the 16 hour exam, there is not a definitive benefit to taking one versus the other". Interesting. Since there obviously isn't a industry need for it, I wonder who will actually volunteer to take a 2x harder test for the same license.

I know there are a lot of arguements either way, but my opinion is that each discipline should be licensed individually. I, like a2mfk, have experienced many engineers thinking they understand a lot about other disciplines simply because they have been around a while. There is probably some truth to this, but when it comes to being held accountable for that design, I think each discipline needs its own standards. Maybe it's purely arrogance but I think Structural things should be left to licensed structural engineers. I personally am sick of utility guys telling me how they "like to design concrete" when they have never cracked a code book like ACI 318!

I hope that the 16 hour test is the right step to take in this direction but it appears that, for now, it is going to be quite ineffective at doing so...

 

[SteelPE]

Massachusetts.

 

[hdp321]

I have no problem taking the test , considering I'd be more comfortable with the content of the structural only test. But, the cost to register for each test is insane. Each test (Fri/Sat) is $550 plus your registration fee. I'm eligible in April, but I'm choosing to wait until October, to save money for the registration fees and to get the extra studying in.

 

[Ron]

a2...no rhyme or reason as to the decisions by our board sometimes. To require the SE-1 as punishment in a non-discipline licensed state is ludicrous. If I were that engineer, I would raise hell with the board.

 

[HSIII]

a2,

My PE stamp actually does have the "civil" designation on the stamp itself.

 

[connectegr]

slickdeals
Illinois, will not grandfather a PE for their SE license. My father has an Illinois PE and 32 other state PE's. Illinois would recognize the PE as completion of the SE I exam, and requires an SE II for the SE license. With 40 years experience the Illinois board required that he take the second SE exam. Our home state does not offer the SE II exam. As some others have mentioned the 16 hour SE exam, may lead to the end of the SE license in some states. West coast states have always had extra requirements and I am sure that will continue.

I have young engineers that have taken the Alabama SE I and then through reciprocity have taken the SE II in other states. None have volunteered to take the SE III on the west coast. The new exam will establish young engineers with higher credentials, but with very little actual experience.

I believe there should be a distinction between Civil and Structural Engineering, in school and licensing. But, I think the boards are going in the wrong direction.

http://www.FerrellEngineering.com

 

[TXStructural]

NCEES intended that the SE 1 & SE 2 would NEVER be given and reported separately, but the states demanded individual scores. The SE1/2 exam was intended to do what the new test intends to do - consolidate the SE examination into one and only one exam. That is the main reason NCEES reorganized which material is covered on which day. The addition of high-seismic was added to please the SE 3 states. BTW, Arkansas PE's do a good bit of design for New Madrid fault areas, so they actually do design for seismic.

SEA of Texas is pushing for SE licensure. Texas SPE and ASCE Texas are against it.
Heretofore, Texas has accepted SE I or Civil/Structural to register as a structural PE, but our "PE" is universal, and if you have a degree in a discipline, have significant experience in it, or have taken the discipline exam, you can practice in the discipline once licensed in any discipline.

If SE licensing does arrive, Texas appears headed toward grandfathering all existing Texas licensed, currently practicing, structural PE's into the practice. They will likely still accept Civil/Structural exams or the new exam for PE registration. Even if there is an SE license created (which is doubtful at this time, as it will require legislation, not just a board rule), only certain types of projects would require it, and the existing practitioners would be allowed to continue in the practice.

I registered yesterday for the new SE exam in April (My PE is based on the SE 1 exam), but then realized it is being given the weekend after ACI's Spring convention - so no time to cram for the exam.

 

[JedClampett]

See attached for a Summary of License requirements from NCSEA.
When I have a little (actually a lot) time I'll read it.

 

[PMR06]

If this keeps up, universities will have to start offering a semester long course just in structural licensing!