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Something lost in the translation?

Something lost in the translation?

Something lost in the translation?

(OP)
As Dave says, be gentle because as, for many, english is not a first language.
The advent of the computer has meant that there are a number of online translators available.
It is rumoured that some of them are not all that could be desired.
I haven't tried this but i am told there is some fun to be had with them by translating from one language to another and then back again. The result is then offered for others to guess the original phrase. For example, the re-translated phrase "water-sheep" appranetly started life as "hydraulic ram".
Does anyone have any other examples?

RE: Something lost in the translation?

Instrument panel: jury on musical devices ?
Induction stroke: cause of apoplexy ?
Stud bolt: a dashing breeder horse ?

RE: Something lost in the translation?

To be fair, contributions should state the translator and languages used, e.g., prove that it's a reproducible result.

TTFN

RE: Something lost in the translation?

I think you'll lose half the fun if you do that!

Good Luck
johnwm

RE: Something lost in the translation?

Because it's too easy to make stuff up.

TTFN

RE: Something lost in the translation?

IRstuff is right. I made that up. It can simply be done by looking at words with multiple meaning while forming a new laughable phrase. However, I must agree with johnwm in that it is still fun.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

One doesn't necessarily need to have another language in the middle. One may find english americanisms that aren't accepted in Britain's English, and may have different meanings. Some examples taken from The Economist:

The use in America                in Britain

in-depth study                  study in depth
riders                             passengers
toward                            towards
hikes                             walks or increases
dumb                            speechless
program (noun)               programme
perception                      belief, view
run for office                  stand...
attorneys                       lawyers
physicians                      doctors
neighbourhood                 district
constituency                    supporters
rhetoric                        speeches or grandiloquence
lay off                          make redundant
additionally                    and
transportation                  transport
corporation                     company
figure out                      work out
meet with people              meet people
outside of America            outside America
cut back                          cut
found on Harley St.             found in Harley St.
rest on weekends                rest at weekends
regular                           ordinary, normal
expect                            anticipate
cricket is a sport              ...is a game
the last issue                  the previous issue
last month                      past month
lifestyle                         way of life
 
A rain-check doesn't imply checking on the shower activity. Alibi is the fact of being elsewhere, not a false explanation. Alternative is one of two, not one of three, four or more. Examples abound.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

(OP)
Lay off or redundancy... you didn't even touch on the euphemisms that any company can come up with for this now. Originally "the sack" from when a workman would be given a sack in which to take his tolls home with him, modern industry has phrases such as "downsize", "restructuring", "rationalisation". Perhaps we ought to take a term like that and see just how many euphemisms (i can say it, I just ain't sure I can spell it)there really are.
The US Army was aware enough of this "two nations divided by a common language" problem to prepare a booklet for the troops posted to Britain during the second world war. If i can find my fathers i will look up a few terms in it: "Muffler" for example is in England the term for an item of clothing to keep warm. On a car it is called an exhaust pipe.
Windshield = windscreen.
Fender = bumper.
Fawcett = tap.
Pavement = sidewalk.
My most perplexing moment was the problem realising that trouser (pants) "turnups" (UK) are "cuffs" (USA, at least, in Georgia they are).
Don't lets forget that even between the outside world and any industry there are terms of confusion and bafflement. When a pharmaceutical engineer talks about "brine" he today means ethylene glycol solution.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

jmw:
I think you mean the following :

fender (US) = wing (UK)
bumper (US) = bumper (UK)

I have noticed that boot(UK) (=trunk US) may be creeping into US use for sports car trunks. Not sure why.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

boot... why
Mini Cooper?

RE: Something lost in the translation?

(OP)
"I had a wreck" (US and more apt)= "I have had an accident" (UK and often anything but; one UK police driving instructor said there are no such things as accidents. Driver error was the politest way to describe his term for it.)
Trashcan=dustbin
Asphalt=bitumen (In the UK asphalt tends to mean bitumen with stones added)
Resume(res you may)=CV
Aluminum=Aluminium
Color=Colour (That US spell checker is a pain)
Politician=crook (in any language)

RE: Something lost in the translation?

Jmw,

Collision is the best term for two automobiles (or pedestrians, etc.) contacting each other.

The element with symbol Al has a colorful naming history, including Alumium.  Aluminium is the correct name, even recognized by the American Chemical Society recently.  Good luck getting Americans to change - we won't use the SI, why would we use one of those "furren" words.

Regards,

Cory

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

(OP)
Following up on a post of IRStuff in another thread, i was searching for Babelfish (or Babel fish) and discovered a huge number of companies who thought this was a great name to "plagiarise". As one of the sites says, did anyone ask Douglas Adams for permission to use his term? or did he get stinking rich?

Anyway, this question of translators led me to discover this site which makes my original post a bit redundant now:
http://www.tashian.com/multibabel/

JMW
www.viscoanalyser.com
eng-tips, Pro bono publico

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

"Si tacuisses philosophus mansisses"
"If you had kept quiet, you would have remained a philosopher"

RE: Something lost in the translation?

But Douglas Adams got it from the Tower of Babel, did he not?

TTFN

RE: Something lost in the translation?

Here’s another story about computer translation.  The story, probably apocryphal, is that "out of sight out of mind" translated into Russian and back to English becomes "invisible maniac".

RE: Something lost in the translation?

(OP)
Yes, but Douglas Adams created the "Babel fish" and popularised it, so most of these sites are exploiting Douglas Adams and not the tower of Babel. Note that the translation site is "Babelfish" not "Babel".

JMW
www.viscoanalyser.com
eng-tips, Pro bono publico

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

"Si tacuisses philosophus mansisses"
"If you had kept quiet, you would have remained a philosopher"

RE: Something lost in the translation?

Adams is dead, he won't sue.  Don't know about his heirs.

Has anyone here fed a phrase into a real translator program and then fed the result into the reverse translator?  That looks like an interesting exercise, wish I had need of such a program so I could try it.

David

RE: Something lost in the translation?

better yet, English to Spanish and back:

Quote:

Wings, poor Yorick. It knew him well.

TTFN

RE: Something lost in the translation?

David - you asked for program to translate out of English and back.

That's what jmw posted:

http://www.tashian.com/multibabel/

Example:

English: "Eng-tips rules"

To German and back again is "English slope it guidelines"

=====================================
Eng-tips forums: The best place on the web for engineering discussions.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

English is a strange language so let's be understanding
to our silicon helpers. Some sentences are -- in E. --
extra difficult e.g. :
"Time flies like an arrow and fruit flies like a banana"

But ambiguity is not the privilege of E -- see the Latin:

"Quid facies facies si Veneris veneris ante?
Non sedeas sed eas, non peres per eas !"

<nbucska@pcperipherals.com>

RE: Something lost in the translation?

If you are going to translate Skakespear, you should at least start with an accurate quotation:

"Alas, poor Yorick. I knew him, Horatio."

Using Babelfish, to German and back, I ended up with:

"Unfortunately, bad Yorick. I could do it, Horatio."

RE: Something lost in the translation?

(OP)
Hm. That reminds me of the story about the ten monkeys with typewriters; sooner or later they will produce the complete works of Shakespeare....

I suspect this muli-babel translator is going to provide just as long a wait for a really good side-splitting multiple translation.

I found another translator which translates into red-neck, cockney, jive and something else (that cartoon with the wabbit). I am not going to post that link because again, though it sounds like a good idea, the output is less than impressive.

JMW
www.viscoanalyser.com
eng-tips, Pro bono publico

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

"Si tacuisses philosophus mansisses"
"If you had kept quiet, you would have remained a philosopher"

RE: Something lost in the translation?

Speaking of translations, are you aware that the interface at www.google.com can be changed to quite a few different languages - including such gems as Klingon, "Bork, Bork", Hacker, Pig Latin, and "Elmer Fudd"?  All mixed in with the more common Latvian, French, two types of Norwegian (???), Esperanto, Breton etc.  But there's only one form of English!

--ducking and running
/jlg

RE: Something lost in the translation?

jmw:

Wherever did you get 'FAWCETT' from? Over the other side it's FAUCET.

You don't live in Portsmouth (Hampshire), by any chance? There's a street there called Fawcett Road. In the road there's a pub. It's called the Fawcett Inn .......

John

RE: Something lost in the translation?

(OP)
Hey! the statute of limitations has expired on that spelling error.

JMW
www.viscoanalyser.com
Eng-Tips: Pro bono publico, by engineers, for engineers.

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

I would never make light of someone with the gumption to venture into this place with minimal English skills, but this quote from a post today fits so well with this topic

Quote:

What mean critical flow in oil wells and what is the relation sheep between critical flow and upstream (wellhead) and downstream (pipe) pressures.

Having worked quite a bit in Wyoming, the "relation sheep" just struck me as probably coming from a translator program, wish I knew what the input was.

David

RE: Something lost in the translation?

   May be you'll find interesting to take a look at the website
         http://www.kli.org/

Live long and prosper,     'NGL

RE: Something lost in the translation?

(OP)
So, to make ones posts interesting, first write them in word, then pass them through the babeliser a couple of times before posting?

JMW
www.viscoanalyser.com
Eng-Tips: Pro bono publico, by engineers, for engineers.

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

zdas04,

I am one of those with - perhaps not minimal, but reduced - English skills. So I think that I can understand your "relation sheep" when I see it from some linguistic distance. What I see is not a furry wool-producing animal but the word "relationship". It makes sense to me. What do you think?

RE: Something lost in the translation?

As a spanish speaker, when I read the quote, I did not even see the error, until later when zdas04 put the words in quotation marks.  It made perfect sense to me since the first two words in the quote alerted me that the poster was probably not a native english speaker.

I am going to open up a thread in the RT soon related to this subject.  (language, not sheep)

rmw

RE: Something lost in the translation?

And, regarding harrisJ's question, isn't Fawcett the way Farah Fawcett, the buxom starlett of a old but popular (I wonder why) TV series, "Charlies Angels" spelled her last name???

Harrisj,maybe this just indicates where JMW's mind is.

I certainly don't mind the reminder.

rmw

RE: Something lost in the translation?

skogsgurra,
I'm pretty sure you're right, it was meant to be "relationship".  What I was curious about is what group of words in (presumably?) Spanish would mean "relationship" in the original, but the dumb computer would turn it into "relation sheep".  

I have the language skills of a stone, and I'm in awe of anyone who is able to successfully communicate a technical question or answer in a language that they're not native to.  Your English may seem "reduced" to you, but I sure would have guessed that you learned it as a young child and must say you communicate very well in the language I grew up with.

David

RE: Something lost in the translation?

Actually, Farrah wasn't really all that buxom.  It was the hair and smile that made the package.

Besides, what's not to like?  Jacklyn Smith and Kate Jackson plus Farrah, making three beautiful women who could kick your butt without breaking a nail?  That's what adolescent wet dreams are made of.

TTFN

RE: Something lost in the translation?

zdas04,

Interesting that you think that I learned English as a very young child. The truth is that I started learning English at the age of fourteen. Our schools were like that back in the fifties. German and French came many years later, mostly because my job situation forced me to use those languages. I think that it is possible to learn new languages fairly well even when you have reached a mature - even overripe - age  

RE: Something lost in the translation?

(OP)
A footnote on the Babel fish originator, Douglas Adams.
The Hitch-hikers Guide to the Galaxy" spawned Earths own version (Adams was one of the creators) which can be found at www.h2g2.com where it is hosted by the BBC.
An interesting and fun site.

JMW
www.viscoanalyser.com
Eng-Tips: Pro bono publico, by engineers, for engineers.

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

For great fun in translations back and forth, read Mark Twain's "The Jumping Frog of Calavaras County."  In his day, it was a major success in the popular American magazines of the day.  It was so popular that someone translated it into French so that those folks could enjoy the story as well.  Despite some loss of drollery because of the American cultural and idiomatic language quirks that didn't carry over into French, it was still fairly well regarded as a good story, although most Frenchmen evidently failed to see what the Americans found so hysterically funny about it.  An Englishman who was unfamiliar with the original story in (American) English tried to translate it back into English for British readers, and it made no sense at all.  British readers wondered why Americans regarded so highly the work of Mark Twain, if this was a sample of his linguistic skill.  Mark Twain himself, upon reading the third version, agreed with them.

I have read all three versions in order, and the third version has again become hysterically funny because it makes so little sense.

RE: Something lost in the translation?

It happened to me quite a long time ago. While at a meeting in memory of one chemistry professor that passed away, one of the speakers reminded the audience of the departed extensive work on "free radicals". I surely heard a non-chemical colleague seating nearby complaining about why this speaker is talking politics...

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