Ethics of Job Offers
Ethics of Job Offers
(OP)
I'd like to get some feedback WRT ethics of employment offers.
I recently went through several rounds of interviews and testing. Finally, I was brought back to corporate for a final round of interviews. At the end of the day the manager gave me an offer letter and his home phone number and said "Give me a call if you've got any questions."
That was Friday. On Sunday evening I sent him an e-mail thanking him and expressing my excitement about the position, and also asking hime to consider increasing the offer amount to come closer to the median salary in this area. I gave him several reasons why I thought it was justified and then closed by again expressing optimism about the opportunity.
When I'd heard no response three days later I sent a follow-up e-mail just to confirm receipt of the original. I received a call from HR saying they were looking into it. The following Monday I received a call from HR saying that they were rescinding the offer because the President had yanked the authorization.
So, what do you think? This seemed like a pretty poor way to treat somebody, especially given that the manager never contacted me but just passed it off to HR.
Any thoughts regarding the ethics of this situation?
I recently went through several rounds of interviews and testing. Finally, I was brought back to corporate for a final round of interviews. At the end of the day the manager gave me an offer letter and his home phone number and said "Give me a call if you've got any questions."
That was Friday. On Sunday evening I sent him an e-mail thanking him and expressing my excitement about the position, and also asking hime to consider increasing the offer amount to come closer to the median salary in this area. I gave him several reasons why I thought it was justified and then closed by again expressing optimism about the opportunity.
When I'd heard no response three days later I sent a follow-up e-mail just to confirm receipt of the original. I received a call from HR saying they were looking into it. The following Monday I received a call from HR saying that they were rescinding the offer because the President had yanked the authorization.
So, what do you think? This seemed like a pretty poor way to treat somebody, especially given that the manager never contacted me but just passed it off to HR.
Any thoughts regarding the ethics of this situation?





RE: Ethics of Job Offers
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
The employer's actions were not professional, but I'm not sure they would violate any ethics considerations, since the President made the decision as a business proposition.
In my opinion, it was unprofessional of the company not to come back to you and even deny the request but keep the offer open. You could still accept or reject the offer at that point. Further, it was not improper for you to raise the question, since you couldn't have raised that point until the offer was made.
Their actions gave you a glimpse at their bureaucratic decision process. Count your blessings and move on to the next one!
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
To avoid this in the future, go prepared with a salary expectation and communicate it with your interviewer. Be prepared to explain how you arrived at the figure - and why you're worth every cent.
Keep hunting - good luck!
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
Dagnabbit! It must mean that I keep lowballing myself. I've never had an offer come back with less than I asked for. However, I do have a pretty good idea of what my work will get in my local job market, so my salary targets are usually not extraordinary.
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
- offer letter, sometimes lower than your expectations from the interview;
- your counter-offer for more money, split the difference;
- final offer;
- accept.
This is the way the game is played. From the interview they already know your expectations. It's easier when you have an agent working the go-between.
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
A classy way to do business? Definitely not.
Basis for lawsuit? Ask a lawyer. I would think for a cash award you would have to show some damages which probably are not much. You might also seek to compell them to honor the offer and hire you but that would not be a good way to begin a new job.
It is natural to wonder about the actual cause of the withdrawal. Certainly you have laid the groundwork for the presumption that it was related to your e-mail. It may now be self-evident, but delicate discussions should almost never be conducted by e-mail. But if your simple e-mail was enough to make him withdraw an offer, he probably is not worth working for.
It is also possible that other events completely unrelated to your e-mail played a role. Maybe another candidate who previously declined has now accepted. Maybe a valued ex-employee called up to ask for work and is preferred. Maybe a contract was cancelled.
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
I've had something very similar happen to me more than once - from both sides of the fence. Jacobs Engineering sent me an offer on a Thursday, but took it away when they lost the project on Monday. I didn't even get a chance to "negotiate".
I once sent an offer to an engineer, just to turn around and recind it due to business reasons (lost a major customer and management was starting a layoff list). However, at least I called the guy as soon as I found out.
So, don't feel bad Binary, it probably had nothing to do with your request for more money.
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
Unless you could show that the offer was made in bad faith, ie an attempt to harm you in some manner, you would have no recourse if you reported for work on Monday morning and were out of a job by lunch.. This would apply even if you quit stable employment elsewhere or moved for the new position.
You are better to have an offer rescinded before you become invested in the new job and cannot return to the new one.
Whether or not it had anything to do with the request for more money or not, I would think that simple good manners would be to have told you that the offer was being rescinded for XXX reason. XXX could be any of reasons speculated to in previous posts. (lack of work, the money request, another candidate was selected etc)
Rick Kitson MBA P.Eng
Construction Project Management
From conception to completion
www.kitsonengineering.com
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
Additionally, aren't you glad that you didn't wind up working for such an inconsiderate and rude person?
TTFN
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
So the point is, that the offeror did not revoke his offer, . . . it was rejected as part of a counteroffer.
Regards,
PM
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
By my definition, that's not a counteroffer.
None of this really matters, though.
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
Let’s say you are buying a house. You submit a written offer of $100k
You receive a written response from the seller saying: “We are very excited about the prospect of you buying our house. The mean selling price for a comparable 4-bedroom, 3 bath in this area is $120k. And most of those comparable homes don’t even have a swimming pool like ours.”
Whose turn is it to respond now?
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
For me, my intention was to accept the job but I wanted to see if they would consider making the compensation more competetive.
Perhaps a casual phone conversation??
Or, once the offer is on the table is it too late to discuss compensation without giving up the offer in hopes of a better one?
I've always been told that you don't discuss compensation until they bring it up or you have an offer. Perhaps there's a better way. That's always worked for me in the past, though.
I do, to some degree, agree with the posters above stating the "maybe you're better off looking elsewhere."
If I weren't so unhappy where I am it would've been easier to stomach. At least I have a job (of sorts).
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
I don't think you can have your cake and eat it too--either you're accepting the job, or suggesting a counteroffer. I went through a similar thing during my first job. I knew for fact that the local HR person had lowballed me relative to corporate hiring practices. However, I was technically renegotiating by calling them on this. I conferred with my manager-to-be, who said he wouldn't rescind the offer (I explained the situation to him and asked him for advice).
I then played chicken with the HR people. They threatened that they could revoke the original offer, but ultimately they blinked and gave me the "correct" offer.
But when HR and your manager are one and the same . . .
Brad
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
I think that a small degree of negotation after the offer is very common. There might possibly be discussion of starting date, vacation, signing bonus, base pay etc. I have done it many times myself. I have only gotten any benefit in once case.... I told them the early start date would cause a hardship and they added signing bonus.
One way to approach the conversation would be: I have not made up my mind yet, but I know I would accept if you added xyz. If they try to pin you down on whether you are rejecting the original offer in favor of your "counteroffer", then tell them you really haven't made up your mind, but with the extra concession, the decision would be easy. To be effective, the discussion has to take place early within the time period that they have allowed you for acceptance. There is slight inducement for them to comply because it removes their uncertainty and moves things forward.
RE: Ethics of Job Offers
Case in point. I started working at a company on a Monday. Wednesday, there was a welcoming party for the new employees, numbering around 12. Friday, half the division, both old and new employees were laid off. Rude? yes, unethical? no, stupid on their part? most definitely.
TTFN