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Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Should I give up on SolidWorks?

(OP)
I started using SolidWorks in January, 1996, got the first copy of Cosmos Works shipped, sent hundreds of bug notifications, helped sell their product, visited their office in person to try to fix problems, and sent in lots of enhancement request.
The problem with legacy files has become even worse, plus I now need to upgrade Cosmos Works and Cosmos Motion for a cost of over $3500.00.
I will only need the FEA and kinematics for a few projects this year, so the cost per hour of use will be more than subcontracting out the design.
So what did I gain with 2003, more crashing when working with older version assemblies, repairing mates, repairing or recreating drawing pages, resaving each file opened, and in some cases starting over. It seems I spend more time fixing problems than creating new designs.
What do you think I should do?

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

If the tool ain't workin' for the job you have at hand, it's time to get a new tool.  If you are on your own, you need stable software, no doubt about that.  I guess you have to gage if dropping your current format for another system will return gains farther down the road.

With that said, my company hardly ever encounters half the problems that I read about on here and at comp.cad.solidworks.  Maybe we do things differently, maybe our designs aren't as complicated as others.  Overall, we feel justified in keeping our subscription up to date.

Ray Reynolds
Senior Designer
Read: FAQ731-376
"Probable impossibilities are to be preferred to improbable possibilities."

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

In my opinion we should not run after each upgrade. And never install the last upgrade or SP unless we know the software is stable and with no bad surprises.

Being constantly up-to-date it's a high price we must pay because there are allways methods we need to change, files we need to convert, configurations we need to test, macros to adjust. And time to do this it's time that we can hardly recover using the new features.

That's why I skip 2001+ and used, with no complaints, SW2001.

Now, with SW2003, I thought it was the time to upgrade, since there are major improvements. I've waited for SP1. I've installed SW2033SP1 and, after one week of conversions and testing (and no design), here I am again, calmly running SW2001.

I've found that, apparently, Oxigen VX1 and VIA chipset are not 1005 compatible and SW2003 doesn't work properly (2001 work fine!). The only help from SW was a link to a site from 3Dlabs reporting this problem. I've installed the latest recommended drivers from 3Dlabs and VIA with no success. Now I only work with SW2003 only for testing porpuses.

I will solve the problem either by correcting it with some help of 3Dlabs or VIA (we are in contact to try to solve it) or by buyng a new computer. But I can't buy a new computer every time that there is a new SW. Nor I can spend one week testing problems in the softawre and/or hardware.

The management don't ask me which version of solidworks I have installed. They ask me about new product sellings and about cost reductions in current production in relation to the R&D budget.

That's why I will install SW2003, and, when everything is going smoothly, stick to it for some years.

Regards

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

It was bound to happen.  I would call SW 2003 a "dud release".  Improvements are superficial, and performance is compromised in the process.  Happens to nearly every CAD program at some time or another.

Kind of reminds me of a bit of folk wisdom I once heard: If you change the water pump in an old car, the hoses will be bursting soon after.  Could be that 2003 demands more of one's resources than was expected.

I am also suspicious about the whole COSMOSWorks things.  I am actually not a fan of extreme interoperability.  It seems to cause more problems than it solves.  Have you tried running SolidWorks without COSMOS and COSMOSWorks?

Gravity is a harsh mistress.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

I am a one man office and I sympathize with your problems, Ed.  I went to SW in Ver 2001 from basic 2D (3D wire frame) and it was a good investment.  My clients loved being able to see the models and I gained much better insight into my own designs.  My machine is Athlon based, lots of memory, and has the Quadro 750 card that SW offered last year for a good price. Also run a Space Mouse. 2001 and + ran fine.  Win2k never crashed and the machine was almost never rebooted.  I went to 2003 and it got ugly.  I was told to get Win2K SP3.  Did that and my backup machine (which had no problems with either version)and then neither version would even load!  Main machine would load but had no effect on crashing.  Was advised to reformat and reload everything... did that, (at great expense of time and some $ for assistance).  Now back up machine runs and main machine is maybe a bit better, but still crashes (the entire system) without warning.  Might be related to the Space Mouse, I am told, but I can't give it up.  I install the latest drivers, SP, whatever, for all my hardware as soon as they are out hoping that will be the "silver bullet".  I have auto backup set for every two changes.  I can't go back so I keep moving forward and hope that it will get better.

I can certainly appreciate that there is a lot going on in the computer.... I am amazed sometimes that it works at all!  However, the stability issue is a scary one for me.  I wish SW would certify hardware combinations that were known to be stable, or fix the software or both.  I can't afford to buy a new computer with each upgrade either but I would certainly look at recommended hardware when it was time to upgrade equipment.  My maintenance contract has bought me very little added productivity and I wil never recoup the lost time and aggarvation due to the instability.

It's a bit like the stock market... I can't get out and it's bound to get better (right!?).

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Hey, I've had files failing from SW2003 sp0 and sp1 and of course, SW2001plus sp5 and sp6.

Even though SW2001plus sp6 is not perfect, it's at very easy dealing with SW2003.

SW2003 is very painful to work with because, again, like most new versions, it has some niceties but it's not production ready.

..  

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

I recently returned to SW after a year on UG.  I originally selected SW2000 over everything else for a start up company I joined.  It was the first CAD package I enjoyed working with and was actually able to do more designing than computer operating.  Of course the company went out of buisness and ended up back on UG.

Then - happy day - I was transfered to a project using SW 2003.  I wish I was back in UG.  I don't know what they did to SolidWorks, but for me (in addition to the slowness and almost daily crashes) it has lost it's natural feel.  I'm back operating software instead of designing again.

I know it's an old thread, but I had to vent this morning - hadn't saved in a while when SW took a break.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

I have found that an Alternative reinstall FAQ559-507 has fixed slow downs in the sketcher, the spinning of models, along with other misc slow downs. I only use this method when all other options have been exhausted, like drivers, setup options, etc...

Regards,

Scott Baugh, CSWP
3DVision Technologies
http://www.3dvisiontech.com
http://www.scottjbaugh.com
FAQ731-376
When in doubt, always check the help

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Scott

     I’m sorry and I sympathize, but this is not a new story. It happens with every release of SW to quite a few people. Part of the problem though is that there doesn’t seem to be any consistency to it.
     We were using SW2000. I think that was the most stable version of the program ever. We only did 2 or 3 SP upgrades the entire time. SW2001 came out and we were slow upgrading to it because we were in the middle of a project and didn’t want to take the chance. I had been monitoring Comp.Cad.SolidWorks for a month and there were very few complaints. So we upgraded and installed the SP (5 or 6 I believe).
     When SW2001+ was released, one of our people insisted on trying it immediately. He didn’t try it on his home system like I would have, he did it on our net and suddenly – everyone had to upgrade to SW2001+ because we couldn’t open any file that he had touched. In 1 week, he opened and saved several major assemblies and 90% of the files had been changed.
     Shortly after that, we purchase 2 brand new identical systems. 1 ran SW and never crashed. The other crashed every 10 or 20 times a day. That was my system. I heard every possible reason for it from operator error to incompatible software that I HAD to have installed. After 2 months I was getting very angry about it. We pulled the hard disks and switched systems. Suddenly my system was stable and the other one crashed all the time. As soon as the CMOS settings were identical, both systems were stable.
     I am still running SW2001+ SP4 and have no intention of changing anything until – possibly – SW2003 SP5 or 6 is out. Even then, I will monitor Comp.Cad.SolidWorks for a month before I do.
     That may be a cowardly way of acting, if so, then I am a coward. There doesn’t seem to be much of a reward for all of the hassle.
 
Lee

It really IS as bad as you think, and they ARE out to get you!

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Lee

That's your choice to do that, and that's fine. I on the other hand cannot do that. I have to upgrade and keep up with the changes. I do also have a seat of SW01+ SP6 on the same machines that runs SW03 SP1.0-3.0 (3 Machines). I don't have much trouble running SW (Never have) Sometimes I get crashes and sometimes I don’t. My most recent problem was the way I was trying to create the geometry. Once I changed the way I was going about it, the file stopped crashing. It can be a number of different things or combinations of things that causes a crash. Its hard to pin point one exact problem.

What I listed above is something I have found that has helped people that have called me for help. Most of their problems were either slow downs or crashes. This method has helped both. Not all the time, but on and average of people I have used this on, I have found about 85% of the time it fixes or helps speed up their display. Those are pretty good odds without having to do a full uninstall and reinstall. Which takes a lot of time to do sometimes.

Best Regards,

Scott Baugh, CSWP
3DVision Technologies
http://www.3dvisiontech.com
http://www.scottjbaugh.com
FAQ731-376
When in doubt, always check the help

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Scott < - - - I like your dancing elephant


     I know. I was merely pointing out what I consider to be an obvious fact. We have a choice to make. We can either – stay current and up to date with SW and the SP’s and take the lumps – OR - upgrade when it is convenient and more likely to be safe.
     Like you, I’ve been around the block a few times and normally - I simply don’t have that many problems. If I had a choice, I would stay current, but normally there are schedules that have to be kept and things that have to be accomplished. They take priority over personal preferences. Somehow, I just can’t see myself going to the Engineering VP and stated that my project is 2 months late because I was stupid enough to trust my software’s reliability. Not unless I wanted to resign in a strange way.

     Then again – I wasn’t the one moaning and groaning or wondering if it is worth it all. - There is no insult intended. - I have read a lot of your replies on this forum and I have a great deal of respect for you. I also respect your commitment to this forum and appreciate the help that you give freely. These are important things – they show the world what we are made of.

Lee


According to an unfinished survey - 9 out of 10 people . . . . .

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

(OP)
Scott how many file do you handle per day?
SolidWorks doesn’t crash if you are not pushing it. The file I worked on this afternoon had about 400 parts, it was built from subassemblies. Some of the parts were created in various versions back to 1996, several were done in 2001+. The dam thing crashed 6 times in 2 hours. The Dell is less than 1 year old running Windows 2000, I’ve reinstalled SolidWorks 2 times, the second time included removing all SolidWorks related stuff, defragging the hard drive and reinstalling. This took the best part of a day, and made no difference. One project I created all the parts in 2003, still crashes when pushed hard. With little time available to do projects, redoing what has already been done cost money. It looks like my design cost will double because of the poor job SolidWorks has done with this new release.
If I have a project that has time and cost limits I can create 10 new parts per hour, and reuse 15+ per hour when designing something, so in a 10 hour day I will handle 120+ files and will see 2 to 3 crashed in the process. If I’m reworking a product It’s not uncommon to have 500+ files opened in an assembly and see crashing every time I start getting ahead of the machine by more than 3 mouse clicks.
My cost of using 2003+ are higher than 97, and it was terrible.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

EdDanzer

     This question might not be worth the air it takes to ask it, but the thought occurred and so I am going to ask it. When SW2001+ came out, it included a program called SldConverter.exe that was used to update all of the pre-2001+ files in a directory. All that the program did was have SW open each file in a directory and save it.

     The question is – How extensively did you guys use it? I know that I only ran it on a few directories and then gave it up as a PITA. We were having a lot of crashes and it didn’t seem to help.

      In my case, it was the CMOS settings that were causing 90% of my problems and they went away. Before they did though, I created a macro that opened a file; forced SW to do several rebuilds, saved it and then closed. I changed it so that it would access specific files and write a report. Different versions of that macro started running on 5 different computers at 6 PM on a Friday night. Monday morning showed that 3 of them had completed their runs – 2 did CTDs. The next weekend the last of the files were done.

     I cannot state that it helped – there were simply too many other things going on at the time - but I have always wondered about it. I know that SW saves every file – faster than you can turn around. Because of that – I wondered why they created the program in the first place. There shouldn’t have been any need for it. The only conclusion that I could draw was that there might be a subtle difference in the code – between a direct save and an indirect save.

     So ask yourself this question. Do you crash as often with new files or with old ones?

Lee

The best leaders inspire by example. When that is not an option, brute force and intimidation works pretty well, too.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Ed,

It depends sometimes...Sometiems I get extremly large assemlbies and sometimes I don't. I have had an assembly open that consisted of 300-400 parts along with the drawing and a couple of other models were not related to that model and I didn't crash. My computer is not that great. I have to get more RAM for it soon. I'm only running 512, along with an Else Gloria Card, 700 CPU. I don't know what HDD. Although I have had smaller assemblies and parts open, that would crash. Had one yesterday on an assembly I'm working on.

Being in the job I'm in now I see a lot different stuff and some of it will push my comupter and some will not. But I have to change my settings all the time to make my computer like the customers, and that has a bearing on the way my computer acts with SW vs. yours and for the most part it's pretty stable.

With your problem it maybe a hardware issue. Even if the computer is less than 1 year old. Have you ever bought a part for you car and it doesn't work...why because it was bad from the factory it was made in. It doesn't happen very often, but it does happen. You may be seeing some bad memory maybe. Works fine till put under a load. Maybe there are 2 differnt types of memory in the machine. Stuff like that is hard to determine the cause. I'm just trying to make that point that it could be anything, no matter how old you computer is, or what you have done to stop your computer from crashing. I understand time is money and for you to try and diagnose your problem is costly to you. I Totally understand, but if you are certain that the install is good then I would start looking at the hardware...just a thought. Have you sent these files to your VAR and see if they crash using it? If they do, then it can be sent in and maybe get fixed in a future release.

Just trying to help

Lee,

Question 1:
I don't run that program. SW will let me know when the files I open up are going to be updated. I lookat it like this. If you haven't full tesed a new release of SW then, and you run that program. You find out later that you can't use it...your SOL now...you have to use it no matter what, unless you want to use dumb solids. I do tests to test a new release out, but I only use Copied parts and assemblies. I make sure that the "File\Find References" is correct before saving in a new version.

Question 2:
I don't crash often enough. Maybe I'm one of the lucky ones but have pushed my machine and software and it runs alright for me.


Again, maybe I'm just lucky, but in my first post, all I was trying to say was try this and see if it helps you. If it doesn't then in that FAQ there is instructions on how to undo what you just did.

Best Regards to you all and Good luck today and every day when running and using SW!

Scott Baugh, CSWP
3DVision Technologies
http://www.3dvisiontech.com
http://www.scottjbaugh.com
FAQ731-376
When in doubt, always check the help

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Hello Ed,

Have you talked to your VAR about the problems you are having?

Have they visited you and tried to help you?

Have you talked to the SolidWorks regional manager?

Have you sent your files to SolidWorks Support?

What has SolidWorks support said about your problems?


Hello macPT,

The Oxygen is very old technology. It was good for its time though. Please look into the ATI FireGL 8800 or the nVidia Quadro.

Cheers,

Joseph

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

(OP)
Lee,
What CMOS settings cause crashing?
As for the converter, it is a joke. We pushed for that product only to find if there is any error created during the update process you are screwed. Some of the products we have created in SolidWorks only get opened when required. In December 1999 we spent over 100 man hours ($6,000.00) to update all the files. Only about 90% were actually competed because of assembly problems that we didn't have time to fix.

Joe,
In the past we had very little success with the VAR or SolidWorks. I have been to SolidWorks 3 different times showing, and explaining problems, only to see changes to the software that makes using it cost more. Until 1999 we spent at least $2,000.00 per year in engineering time trying to work with these people to fix problems only to see no end in site.
The current Dell box is a 2.4 Ghz Xeon, has a Nvidia Quatro 4 900 XGL video card, 1.5 Gb of ram.

As to the replicating the problem, when you are doing full tilt design it is hard to track what causes the problem. Some years ago we found if a certain sequence of key strokes were done Windows would give the blue screen of death, we found this would happen with SolidWorks, Excel, and Word. It took days to figure this out, and turned out to be a DLL problem in NT 5.0, then it took over 6 months for a patch to arrive.

The current problem is we do not have the resources to have increased costs, our customers want more for less, yet SolidWorks gives less for more. Unless you are in management and are required to break down your costs to verify your purchases, and labor charge to a project you may be unaware of the actual cost of using SolidWorks. This costing includes number of hours of use of each software package, learning time, actual time spent doing specific tasks and comparing current cost to past projects.

If you bought a new car and had to spend 20%+ of your time working on fixing it would you be happy?

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

EdDanzer

     I would help if I could, but I’m straight SW – No Cosmos, Cosmic, or Comic knowledge stored here. I tried doing a search in Google Comp.Cad.SolidWorks for Cosmos Error and Cosmos Settings – It did pull up a lot of threads but nothing that will be any help to you

Good Luck

Lee

The best leaders inspire by example. When that is not an option, brute force and intimidation works pretty well, too.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Hello Ed,

To answer your question:

If you bought a new car and had to spend 20%+ of your time working on fixing it would you be happy?

No I would not be a happy customer.

Here is another question:

If you had serious problems with SolidWorks, what action should you take?

I would have the VAR tech team and the SolidWorks regional representative in my office helping me solve this problem.

cheers,

Joseph

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

(OP)
It is difficult to send a 25 Mb file to the VAR or SolidWorks, in the past we sent Zip disks, but that takes time and costs money.
Over the years we ask SolidWorks to send a person out to monitor what we do to test what causes crashing, having flown from Seattle, WA to Concord 3 times, and sent 10 to 20 zip disk, how much more can a 2 seat company do?
If a vendor continues to make poor quality stuff, you quit using them, which brings me back to the original question.
How much crap should a person put up with before you give up.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?


Hello Ed,

If I was your VAR, I would be visiting you right now. Why aren't they visiting you? The number of seats you have should not be an issue, you are entitled to support.

I hate to say this, but if your VAR will not visit you, perhaps you should consider switching to a VAR that will visit you.

Best wishes, I understand your frustration.

Joseph

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

EdDanzer

     I used to spend at least a half a day (quite often a lot more) trimming down an assembly for our Var to look at. I’d remove a dozen or so files at a time, do a SaveAs, then End & Restart and check to see if the problem was still there. It takes a hell of a lot of time.

     Then I started sending CD's. It was a hell of a lot faster and listening to our VAR bitch about having to spend the time trimming down the assembly almost made the problem bearable. There was still a large delay when they couldn’t figure something out and had to send it to SW though. – In fact - I don’t remember ever getting a reply or a solution for one of them.

     This is not a solution, I realize, but you do have a web site don’t you? When you have a problem with a 25 or 250 Meg assembly, dump the files into a directory your web can see and call your var. Give them the URL and a password and let them spend a half hour downloading the files.

     At the same time, you could ask us to look at the problem. Remove anything proprietary first and throw up a questionnaire sheet asking for specifics like – Real name – Company – SW version & SP – Operating system - Comments - and what ever else you can think of that might help. Send that information to your VAR. In short, build a case that overwhelms the size of your company. – Something like: “47 other users tested this assembly and here is what they have to say.”

Good Luck

Lee

ALL of your computer problems have a simple solution - run FDISK and start over.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

Hmmm......  Lots of interesting posts!

This is going to be a bit disjointed and maybe controversial.

We use SolidWorks, SmartTeam, CosmosWorks and a few other things with SW2003 on Win XP.  We have at least 22 seats in the company - not all in the ME dept.  Problems? What problems?  We do not experience any of the horror stories you guys seem to have.  What the heck are you people doing?  True, we are usually one SP in arears, but that has been our safety policy for years - not just with SolidWorks.  We initially had issues with graphics boards, but now we use the Quadro 750 and it is fine.  You can't blame SW for trying to give performance improvement by using a extra feature of Open GL which is supposedy a standard and coincidentally not supported by some of the older graphics boards. Heck, you can't run Win XP on an Intel 286 either!!!!  Technology marches on in the computing world and hardware is on a constant upgrade path.  If you can't stand the heat you need to be out of the kitchen on that score - and that is not intended to be a rude remark - I know it makes things tough for the little guy. Heck, it's tough enough for us and we are part of a LARGE company.

Our assemblies and files are huge and also have extremely complex geometry, mates, etc.  Some assemblies go to thousands of parts (and subassemblies).  We use all kinds or ugly imported suface and solid bodies originating on other CAD systems. (Aircraft structures)  We use multiple configurations and design tables.  We use concurrent design via our PDM system.  Our hardware is built in house.  We seem to have all the things that are supposed to cause the problems, but no problems......

(Just to make you feel better, I do bitch sometimes.  why the heck did they REMOVE the system option to defualt open design tables in a separate window and only allow you to choose when you open it?)

There are some things like changes to the relationships and mates solvers in 2003 (as there were in other rev changes).  Sure we get the red spots and yellow triangles sometimes after conversion.  That is to be expected and we just systematically solve them.  I am not saying this lightly, as we have some complex design tools we have built on SW which do highly complex geometric design.  Sure, it is frustrating to have to spend a little time after an upgrade to check it and fix it as necessary.

This is not a unique problem to SW.  Anyone who thinks brand X is any better in this regard is wearing rose tinted glasses.  I have been in the CAD business on all sides (including VAR) since 1979 and I can tell you this is not simple word processor stuff we are dealing with here.  This is higly complex and often somewhat abstract data.  If you want enhancements you are going to have teething troubles.  The alternative is stagnation, then everyone complains about that!  Luckily for you guys, you never had to deal with the older generations of CAD systems that cost into the millions (and did a whole lot less very slowly).  They would suddenly come out with a new version that was completely different software and database format!!  Of course, they would "help" you to afford to upgrade with a discount, yeah, right!  Even with custom software AND HARDWARE we still had problems.  Frankly I have had much better luck overall with SolidWorks than any other vendor/software I have dealt with in the last 24 years.

In the original post it mentions using SW in 1996 then jumps to SW 2003.  It is not clear whether some or all of the intermediate revs. have been used.  It is all not at all clear if the annual support contract is being purchased.  Now if you are not on support it is not really surprising the the VAR is unwilling to do much for free.  (Remember, I have been there! - why do you think I am not there now?)

If you are on support and not getting REASONABLE assistance, then you need to escalate through your SW regional manager and ON UP if need be.  One typical problem (as I well know) can be that the VAR identifies the problem but the customer does not like the solution (usually based on cost).  Well......?  Like I said, it is rough world in the computing business, particularly for the little guy with small budgets.

I guess the bottom line is that you have to decide is, is it better the devil I know than the devil I don't?  Did you buy more software than you need (or can afford)?  Should you bite the bullet and back another horse?  (That's going to be pretty expensive too initially).  Just don't go that way and in 3 years be writing to their news group complaining and lamenting the good old days of SolidWorks because your new problems now seem terrible and you have forgotten (or maybe gained a better appreciation of) the issues you had with SW.

As you see, I am somewhat but not entirely sympathetic.  As an experienced VAR, system manager and support engineering in the past, I see some familiar traits in some of the comments being made. I have been there and I am realistic about it.

I get the feeling you have already decided and are merely looking for reinforcement.  Please do not look to us all for strokes and justification to make your decision.  Good luck with your decision whichever way you go and I truely mean that, but it has to be your own decision.  

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

JNR

     I try not to think that far back – but – OK. 21 or 22 years ago I was in school using a program called DraftCAD on a Huston Instruments server (Actually – it was owned by Bausch & Lomb) with a custom network. The reason the school had purchased this system was that the instructor could monitor any user in any locations and provide support. The users could also obviously ask for help when they needed it.
     I had been doing 16 CH and was maintaining a 3.9 GPA when this first became available. I jumped on it and took the first 3 (12 hrs) CAD courses. They packed so many bodies on that system that there were actually fights to get on the system. If that was bad enough - every other week some bonehead did something that caused the network to crash. This resulted in an Engineer getting on a plane and flying in to fix it – a minimum of 3 or 4 days down time.
     For the first time ever – I failed 2 of the 3 courses - and my GPA took a nosedive. Worse still, my financial aid was cut in half because I dropped under 12 hours. Both courses were repeated the next semester but I only managed to pass 1 of them. I did Ace all 5 courses - but it took 5 semesters to do it.

     With SolidWorks - I could do any of those courses in a day - two at the most.

     No – I do not like to remember those days.

  Lee

You must remember one thing. You are UNIQUE!!! Just like everyone else!!!

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

(OP)
JNR,
We have use SolidWorks since 1996, gave testimonials to people looking at migrating from 2D to 3D, had models used for advertising in 1996,and 1997. I estimate our investment in SolidWorks is over $150,000.00 on labor and maintenance. We have created over 20,000 SolidWorks files and been current on all maintenance until this year and we can’t justify the Cosmos maintenance. We estimate we will use Cosmos less than 50 hours. We don’t want to throw that investment away, yet this last release in general has cost dearly to use. With the current economy we don’t have the resources to maintain the file problems that have been created.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

EdDanzer

     I hate to agree with JNR, but it does sound like you have made up your mind. I don’t have any idea where you think the grass will be greener, but it does seem obvious that you intend to find out.

     I think part of your problem is your outlook. Read back through the posts that you have made in just this thread. A recurring theme seems to be – Look how much this costs me. I am not saying that you are making up numbers – only that you may be spending too much time looking at only half of the numbers. Not once have you mentioned how much the software has made you. Not once have you stated that you are getting more work done per hour than ever before.

     I think we have both used enough different CAD systems to be able to judge them critically. For myself, I have never been more productive, been able to do more things in less time – than I have since I made the transition to SolidWorks. I have made better LOOKING drawings in other programs – I have a portfolio full of them - but the amount of time I spent making them was phenomenal.

     That doesn’t say that I do not get disgusted with SolidWorks when it does a CTD or when I loose an hour’s work - because I do. I try to place the blame where I think it belongs. I know that SolidWorks has stability issues, so if I loose much more than an hour or two – in a week – then it’s my own damn fault. Yes – I could blame the software – but that is like suing McDonalds because they served me the hot coffee I ordered. It just doesn’t make a lot of sense and it is counter productive.

     I do know that many people are going to miss your presence - at least - I will.

     Good Luck and God Speed – I think I will shut up now.

  Lee

You must remember one thing. You are UNIQUE!!! Just like everyone else!!!

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

(OP)
Well we have not found a better choice than SolidWorks, it just drives me nuts. When we program a CNC machine in G code we can use the file for years, change a few lines of code and move the program to another machine. I have a program to machine a parabola that was done in 1984 and was used in 1999 in a different machine with very little modification this could run on my current machine with less than 30 minutes worth of work. An assembly file created in SolidWorks last year may need 1 to 2 hours of additional work just to print production drawings when no changes have been made.
Am I the only person how hates to do the same thing over after doing it correctly the first time? Maybe it’s because I get paid to do it once.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

I have used numerous CAD packages both 3d and 2d and i have come to one conclusion. There is no perfect CAD package. Once you finally let yourself come to grips with this you then can become more productive.

RE: Should I give up on SolidWorks?

I hear what you say, but remember that G code is pretty simplistic stuff (AND INDUSTRY STANDARD) as is the math definition of a parabola. It illustrates my "word processor" analogy.  Characters, words (one word = n characters with a certain special characters at either end), paragraphs, etc. And all using STANDARD ASCII codes.  The only difference is in the cute stuff to format documents.  It is not rocket science and the results can be easily moved from one software to another and translated (yeah, I know even then there are problems - blame Bill Gates if you need to find a scapegoat).  CAD software deals with vastly more abstract data and data manipulation.  Every system handles things differently - heck, just look at the mind boggling issue of mapping "flat" drawings of 3D objects!!! There is (and never will be) any real standardization in the CAD world, except for some companies using the same solids kernel.  I have more power on my desk top today than all the CAD systems used to design the Boeing 757 aircraft put together.  Then you have all of us lot demanding more stuff and faster delivery and perfection for next to nothing - ain't going to happen!  Too many lines of code.  You just can not test every combination. You just can't run a full-up Monte Carlo type test on all possible combinations in a product like SolidWorks or its competitors.  Like some of you said, no system out there is perfect and whichever horse you back it WILL and DOES have its similar problems from time to time.  I'm not saying SolidWorks is any better or worse just that when you jump over the fence, you will find the grass is no greener after all.  Oh, it will look green and taste different at first as you joyously cavort in unfamiliar pastures, but as you become more accustomed to it and learn to graze more proficiently, up will pop the weeds again!!  Sawing off two blocks of wood, match drilling them and screwing them together is a simple operation in the real world.  You try to write a program to fully simulate that and then tell me you don't get it.  Most people have no idea of the gross complexity involved.  One problem is that in the bad old days of "wire frame" the user was much more aware of the realtiy of the situation. With today's solids systems, the simulation of the real world is so good that we lose sight of the fact that it is indeed nothing but a highly complex simulation.

Here's another interesting thought for you.  Remember what happened to ProE selling for what - average $16K a seat and along comes SolidWorks and cuts their legs out from under them at $4k a pop? Heck they were charging $7k for annual maintenance! (Of course the fact that ProE were trying to peddle it like arrogant used car salesmen at the time didn't help.)  Ever see a ProE user move to SolidWorks and see their eyes light up first time they go to change something near the front of the database?

(BTW: StarrRider, we must both be REAL oldtimers - I remember the Bausch and Lomb stuff!!)

Frankly, if you NEED COSMOS, but can't afford to pay for it, you are underfunded and in the wrong business.  Sorry to bring reality into this, but that's a plain fact.  You will just have to employ an subcontractor to do the anaylsis and figure the cost in your bid.  Or there are packages that you can rent by usage. If that makes your bid too high - there's a message in that for you. Sorry to be blunt my friend but it's a tough world specially for the little guy.  Believe me, I do sympathize with that problem.

Ya know, Rocko's two liner sums this entire thread up nicely. I will also shut up now......

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