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space ball 3d controller?
2

space ball 3d controller?

space ball 3d controller?

(OP)
Does anyone use such a device?  They are selling regularly on ebay for less than $100.  Retail is over $500.  So either they are complete garbage or they are just overpriced.

I am looking to reduce some wrist strain, and this seems to be a good device for that.

Thanks

Gerry
www.scatmat.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I'm curious about those things too... and a little sceptical.
On the one hand:
Unless I need to simultaneously rotate and modify my model, why do I need one of these?
I have a wireless/optical Microsoft IntelleMouse Explorer That's the best thing I've done to reduce wrist strain and overall comfort.
On the other hand:
I'm a gadget guy and darn-it if they don't look cool.
They're probably fun to play with too.
I'm thinking of asking our VAR to send us one to try-out for a month.


Consume mass quantities...
tatej@usfilter.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

A collegue if mine uses a space ball all the time. he is wery pleased with it. He is mainly using it with the left hand , and using the mouse with the right hand.
It has some buttons that is assigned to corresponding buttons on the regular keyboard he uses, like CTRL etc.

I think he bought it for approxemately 600-700$, but that´s some 5 years ago.

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I use a spaceball myself.  My company purchased it when we bought Catia in which it is a must almost.  We also run Solidworks and I use it there also.  It is a bit cumbersome at first but really works nice.  Your screen orientation can become a bit messed up it you use both the spaceball and the center mouse button.  We paid arout $550 for it 2.5 years ago.  If you get one you will love it.

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I use a FLX-4000 Spaceball from 3D Connexion and would not give it up. You can program the buttons to for use in a part file or an assembly file and the device knows which kind of file it is operating in. It does take a little getting use to, but in the long run you will be saving alot of time by not having to find icons or look at the keyboard to find the short-cut keys.

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Yep, they are all that and a bag of chips IMHO. I bought 2 from eBay. Both 2003's. Yes old indeed. However, they both worked fine. They have 9 buttons that as stated are "document sensitive". So you reall get 27 buttons depending on how you set the device up. As stated you will need a day or 2 to "train the mind" to use both hands. However, after you get over that hill I suspect you will wonder how you ever got by w/o one. I managed to get both of mine for $30.00 each. From eBay. These things go way beyond just being able to rotate and select at the same time. I.E. you can: rotate, pan, zoom AND select at the same time. As well as move parts in asm's on the control of the spaceball. Also is my favorite, you can grab something and drag with the mouse AND move with the spaceball. How many times have you had to click and drag something to some place not visible on the screen (due to zoom or whatever)? I can grab something and while holding the item to drag can pan/zoom the model as needed. W/o spaceball you would have to possibly, gab drag to edge of screen then zoom out, and do it all over again. ACK!! This feature alone makes it very worthwhile IMHO. This situation happens a lot when sketching in/on large models. Working in one area and suddenly you need to drag something to the other side of the model. PITA! w/o spaceball/mouse. After I had mine set up. I got to the point where I only use the keyboard to enter numbers.

Regards,

Sean F
seanf@newing-halll.com
There is 1 to many l's in the email. Fix to respond.

RE: space ball 3d controller?

OK - before I buy one of these...
I borrowed one from my VAR to try it out.
Holymotherofpearl! I'm out of control!
Been using it for half a day and all I can to is laugh at my inaility to do anything more than a high-speed fly-by.
Yea, sure, once in a while I can get a small subtle movement, but mostly I get vertigo.
I'll keep it up for at least a week.
Here I go again... yaaaaaa!


Consume mass quantities...
tatedeleteredj@usfilter.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Spaceballs are cool and all but I have found something even cooler!

Check out this link

http://www.dimentor.com/

This is a mouse with a built in spaceball type device... I love it!

Regards,
Jon
jgbena@yahoo.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

That looks excellent Jon (steeples fingers like Mr. Burns).  Thanks for the link.

"The attempt and not the deed confounds us."

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I have one and love it too! Using it is as simple as holding the model in hand. Rotating it is really natural. And another good thing is that you can use it to manipulate your design during all commands active. For example you cannot rotate your model when editing dimension value but 3D mouse allows you to rotate during that time.

RE: space ball 3d controller?

So what does this "inspector" cost. You have sparked my interest. However, they are closed for the day. I would like
to know what they cost. If you don't mind.

TIA,

Sean F
seanf@newing-halll.com
1 2 many l's in the email.

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I use a 3DConnexion Magellan & love it. Couldn't imagine working without it. It takes about 2 weeks to get used to it. Use the programmable buttons & you can really fly.

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I didnt purchase mine, I am using the one that I got from solidworks world through my company... I need to verify this with my sales weasel but I think I remember it being around $400 US

Regards,
Jon
jgbena@yahoo.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Scarecrow-

I highly recommend it!  I purchased mine through E-bay also and would not go back.  I am currently using the Spaceball 4000.  I to was experiencing wrist strain and had developed tendonitis from a standard mouse.  Over the past few months the strain and tendonitis has disappeared.

Another benefit was that once I stormed past the initial learning curve, I was able to really put it to use and increased my productivity.  It helps so much when rotating parts and assemblies.  I have the buttons mapped so I rarely use my keyboard shortcuts.

Hope you enjoy!

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I've been using this Spaceball 4000 FLX for 5 days.
I'm able to manipulate my model as I want - although a little clumsily.
I'll use it for another week, before I send it back to my VAR - it's borrowed.
At this point I can say - sure, it'll spin and pan that model like nobody's business.
But I can't honestly say that it'll do it faster than my IntelliMouse.
Yes, I'm getting better with it, but even considering the learning curve, I don't think this will ever reach a point where I'm faster with the SpaceBall.
I'm trying to be fair - because I am a gadget guy and I'd love to be able to justify the $$$ of one of these.
Maybe I'll get a older model anyway, just for the fun of it.


Consume mass quantities...
tatedeleteredj@usfilter.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

(OP)
Well folks,
I purchased a used spaceball 3003 from ebay ($82), and it works fine.  I have been using it for about 5 days, and here are my thoughts:
I find it easier and more natural to use the big rubber ball to rotate and pan my model than the mouse.  The first few days were pretty scary, but once you configure the beast correctly it's great.

My only reason for purchasing this device was to reduce wrist strain and work load on my right arm.  I am begining to notice a reduction in wrist and tendon pain.  Hopefully this will continue to improve as time moves on.

I plan on upgrading to a newer model when the budget allow's it, but for $82 how can you go wrong?

Thanks for all the input from you.

Next report in 3 months.

Gerry Bolda
www.scatmat.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Question for y'all pro-SpaceBallers:
What mouse were you using before and how did you have it configured?

Mine - for example - is a Microsoft Intellemouse Explorer (optical & wireless).
I have the small thumb button (STB) set-up for SPACEBAR (View Orientation) and the large thumb button (LTB) for CNTL. And I ZOOM with the WHEEL and PAN with LTB/WHEEL.
The only downside is sometimes I have to roll the wheel a few times to get the ZOOM I need. Still, this is pretty doggone fast.

What were you doing before that makes the SpaceBall so much faster by comparison?
I just don't see it... yet.


Consume mass quantities...
tatedeleteredj@usfilter.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I am considering picking up the spaceball 3003. Does this require any special software or other hardware?  The ones I've seen on e-bay don't mention it but in product reviews I have read about spaceware software that is used to program the buttons.  Whats up?

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Chancey,
Yes you will need drivers. If you are talking SldWks they can be had here:
http://www.3dconnexion.com/software/drivers/win:SolidWorks200020012001Plus2003.html
The 2 driver files will be all you need. Everything is pretty straight forward for setting it up. If you have any direct questions post here or email me direct if you get one I will help you with any questions if I can. There are some 2003's selling now from "connectcomp" and some 3003's if I remember right(looked yesterday). I got both the 2003's that I have from connectcomp and would recomend them, both the 2003's for more buttons than a 3003 and connectcomp for not selling me junk, and shipping per my requirements. Item was in the mail quickly. I would buy from this outfit again. You want to make sure you are getting a power cable setup with it as well. If not I will say that 3Dconnexion sent me one for free on request. For a model that someone bought at a local auction(not ebay). The hook-up on most 2003's and 3003's is serial I am pretty sure. So you will need a working and open serial port.

Regards,

Sean F
seanf@newing-halll.com
1 2 many l's in email   

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I'm finally getting a spaceball... Order went in yesterday for a spacebell 5000. After years of drooling, I finally get to use one on my own.

Scott Baugh, CSWP
3DVision Technologies
http://www.3dvisiontech.com
http://www.3dmca.com
FAQ731-376
When in doubt, always check the help

RE: space ball 3d controller?

hi scott,

do you mind sharing with us how much you paid for your new toy and where you ordered it from?

best regards, rich

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Hi to all... I have not read all the inputs but can offer mine as I have been using a Space Mouse Plus for several months now.  I was motivated to consider it due to serious strain issues on my right wrist from all day SW driving.  I wanted to spread out the load.  My SW VAR gave me a good deal on one so I sprang for it.  (I am self employed so what ever I spend at work does not make it home.)

I am now so dependent on my Space Mouse that I find it almost unbearable to work with only a mouse at home.  Any one who uses SW for more than a few hours a day is doing them selves a grave disservice by not employing this wonderful device.  Yes, it has reduced the burden on my right hand (and I have since added a Logitech cordless Trackman (trackball)), but more importantly the Space Mouse provides an enormous boost in productivity.  You won't believe how natural and cool it is to manipulate your models with mere pressures of your left hand while doing picking and commanding with your right.  There are nine buttons arrayed around the puck that you can program very simply with included software to do just about anything.  I have added a "ctrl" key, zoom to fit, mates, etc. to my buttons.  The "sub part toggle" when in assemblies saves tons of right wrist steps all by it self.

The unit is extremely well made... very solid.  The Plus is USB and sets up with no trouble.  Most of the units on eBay are the older units that are serial devices.  I can't comment on them but the ergos are a bit different and I had heard from a former user that there were occassional hardware issues.

In summary... I completely recommend it with out reservation... it is a must have.  I am  a second for my home machine as soon as my hardware budget builds up a little.  Put it on your credit card and don't look back.

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Sean F,
     One of my associates gave me his SpaceBall 4000 FLX without the drivers.  He lost them. I down loaded the drivers from www.3dconnexion.com.  ;
I have installed 3DxWare_v3-1-11_win32.exe and 3DxSolidWorks_v2-2-6_win32.exe. 3Dcontrol add-in does show up in the SolidWorks Add-Ins. When I start SolidWorks, it tells me the
“SpaceMouse/SpaceBall driver not found. Please start the SpaceMouse/SpaceBall driver now. You do not have to shutdown SolidWorks”.
Do you have any reason this does not work?

Bradley

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Bradley,
I would start by checking the taskbar for a "cube icon". If the driver is running you should have such icon. If you didn't select "start driver with winblows" when you installed the driver, then you will have to make sure you start it yourself / or put the startup command for the driver in your startup folder. Now, if you don't see the driver icon:
[START]->[PROGRAMS]->[3DConnexion]->[3DXware]->[Start Driver]
That will start the driver. Now with that said, if you then get a message that "Device such&such can not be found" that is a hole different can of worms. However, hardware problems aside, that should get it going.

Regards,

Sean F

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Sean,
Looks like it might be hardware. Now I get the message “No 3D Motion Controller Could be Detected”. I did check to see if it is plugged in, and yes it is. The controller did work on the last guy’s computer very well. Do you have any more ideas?

Bradley

RE: space ball 3d controller?

(OP)
Hi Brad,
i get this error as well.  After a number of different tries i find the best sequence is this:
start your pc
load the software program you will be using for the day, in my case solidworks.  It will say no driver loaded.  Ignore it and open any part.  Now go to the windows start menu and open the connexions tab and start the driver. Nine times out of Ten it will load fine.  If if try to load the bugger before solidworks i get no device found everytime.  A weird windows thing.
I am using win 2000 with S/W 2003.
Let us know if this works for you?

Gerry Bolda

RE: space ball 3d controller?

My suggestion is start looking at any modems you have. I had to disable the modem in this box I use @ work. Modems seem to conflict with the driver. I am sure it's probably a "serial thing". At any rate disable any modems you have in the device manager. Then reboot. Then attempt to start the driver. If you can then get it going you at least know who to blame "per-se". However, for some living w/o a modem can be a pain. TGFBB (thank god for broad band). On a lighter note. If disabling the modem works, you should then be able to assign hardware related to the modem in such a way that the two can live in peace.

Let me know how it goes. If it worked on "box X" and it don't work on yours. My first bet is a modem. Now that the driver is running. Also, I concurr with the above post in that starting the driver w/winblows is not the way to go. I just start it when I need it. If winblows is going to flake-out. It will usually be on boot IMHO. So the less that happens on boot the better.

Regards,

Hope this helps.

Sean F

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Gerry Bolda,
I removed 3dconnexions from my boot. Rebooted a couple of times to no avail. I started SolidWorks, opened a part, then started the driver. Still get the same error. “No 3D Motion Controller Could be Detected”.
Sean F,
I checked for modem connections and have none. We are on broadband.

Bradley

RE: space ball 3d controller?

Bradley,
Ok, make sure the box does not have an onboard modem. If it does disable it in the BIOS. Also, check bios setting to confirm that the com/serial port you are using is enabled, and set up correctly. Then make sure the com's are set up properly in windows. Now, with that said. Do you have the external power supply for this unit? The way that it was explained to me is that, some serial ports run a bit more power than others. If the box the unit in question came from had a stronger com port then that could be a reason for the unit not being detected on the new box. The power supply for one of these should jump into the com lead for the spaceball. The 2003's that I have will not run w/o an external power supply on any of the computers I have. If you do not have the power supply, I would call 3Dconnexion tech. They sent me a power supply for a serial model for free. I would assume if you were nice they would do the same for you.
Really, if it worked on the other computer, and it never got "dropped" when it was moved from one to the other, then outside of a com port conflict or power supply issue there is no reason it should not work. I really suspect a com port issue before power supply on the newer unit you have. Make sure there is nothing else in the system using the com port. If you had some serial device installed and removed it w/o uninstalling the drivers for it then possibly that is what is causing the conflict. The drivers for that "other" device may still be mucking up the com port for the spaceball. The 4000FLX model is hella newer than mine so they may not require the external power supply. I don't really know. If possible, I would call this guy:
Contact for Technical Support:
Ken Denton
Tel: (888) 247-9545
Fax: (248) 331-1399
Email: ken_denton@3dconnexion.com
He was a big help to me. As well as the person that saw to it that I got a free power supply to see if that would get the unit working. I was very impressed by the level of service that I received from him.

Hope this helps,

Sean F
seanf@newing-halll.com
1 2 many l's in email

RE: space ball 3d controller?

OK - I'm sold. Not because I think my efficiency/productivity will increase, but because this thing is so darned cool.
To recap: I've borrowed a Spaceball 4000 FLX from my VAR. I'm not going to buy this  - too much $$$ - but I think I'll get an older model off ebay.
My questions:
Aside from the buttons or lack thereof, are there any other differences between the 3003 & 2003 models? I'm thinking the 2003 has a bigger footprint.
Are the drivers equally available for SolidWorks 2003?
Is there a chance that the 2003 will become obsolete before the 3003 - in terms of drivers for future SolidWorks versions?

I wonder if I could mod one of these things - maybe a glowing ball or light saber sound effects.


Consume mass quantities...
tatejATusfilter.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

TateJ,
2003 vs. 3003, well neither has enough buttons for me so I coded my own popup box for SldWks that is "doc sensitve" that I use to provide endless buttons and functions.
Drivers, same for all spaceball models. Regardless. To the best of my understanding the 2003 will be supported as long as the 3003 is. Same drivers for all models. The driver "detects" the model you have. It then configures the driver for that model. Both models work the same. Minus the number of buttons. The "way" they work is exactly the same.
As far as the footprint, you are correct. 2003 is bigger. However, I like it as that makes the unit VERY stable on the desk.
Modding, the 3Dconnexion SDK is a free d/l from the 3Dconnexion site. As far as "glowball" and sound effects goes, good luck :) However, the sound effects I would bet are possible via the Connexion SDK.

Glad you like the spaceball. You would have to "pry mine from my cold dead hand" :)

Regards,

Sean F
seanf@newing-halll.com
1 2 many l's in email

RE: space ball 3d controller?

I have worked with the Space mouse and I love it, too.
(what surprise)

Now I have no money to buy my own 3D imput device.

Is there any alternativ, cheeper way?
Can I use my Joystick with some special driver to rotate or pan/zoon in SW or some other CAD application?

Regards,
Christoph

RE: space ball 3d controller?

MrVirus,
I would look to eBay for a spaceball. That is about as cheap as you are going to get one. I got both of my 2003's for 30 each. I don't know if you can get the devices you mention to work as a spaceball does.

Again, I would try eBay.

Regards,

SeanF

RE: space ball 3d controller?

New question:
Now that I have this Spaceball...
Quite often - while working in a drawing - I have the drawing view active (I mean the handles are showing).
Then when I want to pan or zoon, I end up dragging my view all over hell & half of Texas.
Is there a way to completely lock a view - or de-activate the handles?
Or a way - with the SpaceBall drivers - to stop this?
It's very annoying - I must say.


Consume mass quantities...
tatejATusfilter.com

RE: space ball 3d controller?

TateJ,

Of course you can turn it off :)
Procedure as follows:

Start SldWks
Select 3DControl from the pull down menu
Select Properties
Select the options tab
Confirm that checkbox "Move on Select"(Under drawing views) is NOT CHECKED!
(right hand side, middle of dialog box)

Regards,

Sean F
Mechanical Engineer
seanf@newing-halll.com
1 2 many l's in e-mail

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