steel canopy - beam column connection
steel canopy - beam column connection
(OP)
Im designing a steel canopy. All steel elements are hollow profiles (box profiles). All connetions are asummed as pinned. Because of that I braced a construction in roof plane
I have some thoughts about top of column - beam connection. I dont have much experiences with hollow/box profiles but in this case I have to use them.
Im wondering if connection shown in picture is alright in your opinion? Is there a better way?
Bolts are inside of a box profile so the beam would need to rotate quite a bit in order for considerable tension in bolts to develop. Is that right?
Bolts are definitely in tension when winds in blowing upward (resisting uplift) but forces are small.
Shear demands on bolts will be small too.
Is there anything Im missing? im not so confortable with shown connection (but it is aesthetically pleasing) so I want to make it sure before proceeding.


I have some thoughts about top of column - beam connection. I dont have much experiences with hollow/box profiles but in this case I have to use them.
Im wondering if connection shown in picture is alright in your opinion? Is there a better way?
Bolts are inside of a box profile so the beam would need to rotate quite a bit in order for considerable tension in bolts to develop. Is that right?
Bolts are definitely in tension when winds in blowing upward (resisting uplift) but forces are small.
Shear demands on bolts will be small too.
Is there anything Im missing? im not so confortable with shown connection (but it is aesthetically pleasing) so I want to make it sure before proceeding.








RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
You will find any type of connections (welded, bolted, etc)
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
best regards
Klaus
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
Why is it not an option?
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
As an alternative, you could extend your column cap plates 6" towards the middle of the frame and then fasten to the beam from below with blind bolts (check regional availability). Perhaps the design intent here is a "no bolt" concept. If so, it may be tough to get away from welding.
I like to debate structural engineering theory -- a lot. If I challenge you on something, know that I'm doing so because I respect your opinion enough to either change it or adopt it.
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
best regards
Klaus
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
I dont know what do you mean.
DO NOT weld?
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
usually the material used for Nuts and bolts is not weldable
best regards
Klaus
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
I was trying to avoid welding since it destroys galvanazing of an element where it is welded (at a joint).
So there needs to be another protection of steel (anti corrosion).
I decided to weld connection (butt weld).
Would you consider that a moment frame (horizontal loads are small), or it will be wise to add a stiffener between column-beam?
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
There are many option to do such a structure.....depending on the 'boundary' conditions
- Architectural
- Production
- transportation
- erection
and on and so on .......
best regards
Klaus
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
I like red shirts better :)
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
Dik
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
also depending on the wall thickness the corners are rounded ...so this butt weld does not work
best regards
Klaus
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
- cut ends of column and beam at 45º and butt weld;
- keep your bracing at roof level;
- design connection as pinned.
For additional info, check CIDECT design guides 1, 3 and 9.
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
- cut ends of column and beam at 45º and butt weld; - beam and column are not the same dimensions so 45 degree is not an option. Column is 100 x 100 mm and beam in 100 x 150 mm
- keep your bracing at roof level - horizontal forces are very small and whole construction is 2,5 x 3,2 m, i think there is no need for that if beam is welded to a column
- design connection as pinned - i would agree with that if I had larger construction and horizontal forces. If connections are pinned then I really DO need to make horizontal bracing in roof plane, otherwise the construction is labile.
i have seen many canopies similar to this one in my country. They are mostly welded together. Almost none of them has an additional bracing in roof plane.
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
Do you mean EN 1993-1-8 § 4.14 ? If not, could you please elaborate?
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RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
You can weld ...but this weld cannot be used for structural design
best regards
Klaus
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
Keep the lateral bracing since you are pinned everywhere.
Most of mine were in high wind areas but some in high snow load areas as well.
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
This is a topic in european construction code, which allows for interpretation and widely different views.
Always happy to see another point of view, as I think I got the answer (see the ref. I mentioned above) but there's always more than one side to every story.
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RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
This is written in Eurocode ...but is also common practice (in Germany)
best regards
Klaus
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
Can you site the section number? I am not aware AISC has this provision, for statically loaded members, at least.
One in the hand is worth two in the bush.
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
Any chance for the standard and paragraph?
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RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
EN 1993-1-8
Section 4.14 Welding in cold-formed zones
best regards
Klaus
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
Flare bevel groove welds are used all the time between standard structural tubing in the US. Its approval is specifically documented in US design codes. I imagine it is not hard to meet the material and dimensional requirements of EN 1993-1-8 to allow the same.
One in the hand is worth two in the bush.
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
where you will find that, if you apply Table 4.2 from EC3-1-8 on cold-formes hollow profiles, you might (depening on the actually used radius) encounter problems starting from a wall thickness of 12mm, which is thicker than the most common used hollow profiles for carports and similar structures.
Edit: Thx MacGruber22 for the article, I have added the file to my library dedicated to this problem. I've had this discussion several times before, but I hadn't seen this document yet. (I hope you get some sleep nowadays!)
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RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
I like to debate structural engineering theory -- a lot. If I challenge you on something, know that I'm doing so because I respect your opinion enough to either change it or adopt it.
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
One in the hand is worth two in the bush.
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
I like to debate structural engineering theory -- a lot. If I challenge you on something, know that I'm doing so because I respect your opinion enough to either change it or adopt it.
RE: steel canopy - beam column connection
One in the hand is worth two in the bush.