Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
(OP)
I got laid off after spending 16 years as an engineer at a Fortune 100 company. I was never into leadership, so remained an "individual contributor". My job career was unique in that for many years I hardly had enough work to do. It was a combination of laid back bosses and go-getter co-workers who enjoyed doing everything themselves. I also never could really connect with my co-workers. Most came from small towns and had nothing better to do or talk about than work. To me it seemed they were always "busy doing nothing". For the last five years of my career I worked from home in a much bigger city nearby.
My job was providing high-end technical support to R&D engineers. But I would make it clear to people I was not there to hold their hands. They had to have a basic understanding of things and it was not my job to teach them that. With this attitude I minimized a lot of unnecessary work. At the same time, some folks may have seen me as "unapproachable". So it was a delicate balance trying to please the power users without offending the newbies.
As a result I invested my spare time in a side-business, managing rental properties and churning credit cards. I also invested my time reading up on investing and taxes.
Anyways, I've been unemployed for 7 months, but will be starting a new job soon. I want to start things on a new leaf. What advise would you have for succeeding in corporate jobs? From my experience, one should never say NO to anyone's request. The challenge with this is you get overloaded and spread yourself too thin. How does one manage that successfully?
My side-business has shrunken a lot so I no longer spend much time on it. I recently hired a property manager for my rentals, so that has taken a load off me. Last, credit card churning is almost done as banks have all cracked down on it. So I have plenty of time to devote to my new career!
My job was providing high-end technical support to R&D engineers. But I would make it clear to people I was not there to hold their hands. They had to have a basic understanding of things and it was not my job to teach them that. With this attitude I minimized a lot of unnecessary work. At the same time, some folks may have seen me as "unapproachable". So it was a delicate balance trying to please the power users without offending the newbies.
As a result I invested my spare time in a side-business, managing rental properties and churning credit cards. I also invested my time reading up on investing and taxes.
Anyways, I've been unemployed for 7 months, but will be starting a new job soon. I want to start things on a new leaf. What advise would you have for succeeding in corporate jobs? From my experience, one should never say NO to anyone's request. The challenge with this is you get overloaded and spread yourself too thin. How does one manage that successfully?
My side-business has shrunken a lot so I no longer spend much time on it. I recently hired a property manager for my rentals, so that has taken a load off me. Last, credit card churning is almost done as banks have all cracked down on it. So I have plenty of time to devote to my new career!





RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
Other suggestions for your new leaf:
Don't let anyone at work know you have a side business.
Better, don't have one.
At the very least, never conduct side business on your main business' premises.
This includes not answering the cell phone that you use for the side business.
Don't brag about your credit card churning.
Don't even mention it.
It doesn't reflect well on your character.
When you get busy, get efficient; find ways to make yourself more effective.
That does not include refusing to help people who need it.
Hold hands, if that's what it takes to get >your customers< up to speed.
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
It's not never saying no, its about proving why when you are saying no there is a very good reason AND giving an alternative solution. I will admit, most times people will give some reason why they can't/won't do something, but at least offering some solution will show people you are willing to invest in their success. As MikeHalloran said, hold hands if that is what is needed to have your customers succeed. Their success is your success. You need to have a semi-decent relationship with your manager, because they'll have to go to bat for you sometimes when you say no. Take the time to cultivate the relationship; you don't need to be friends, but you do need to trust each other.
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
1)the many people?
2)geographical setting?
3)the one person?
Maybe all/most outside factors will turn to your favor and this similar job will, on its own accord, be a better experience for you.
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
to paraphrase: If you wake up one day and meet one Adolf, well, you met an Adolf. If you wake up one morning and everyone you meet is an Adolf, well... who's really the Adolf?
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
I said 10-15% of users I deal with are challenging , not everyone. Surely we all have aspects of our job that we consider not to be in our job duties. For example, one of my duties was supporting FEA software ( installation, optimizing, opening bug reports with vendor ). Is it my job also to teach users how to use FEA? No, but many engineers who never took a university course on FEA would expect that.
Similarly, another duty of mine was helping people get their code to run in a high performance computing environment. Is it my duty to teach people who know nothing about coding how to code? No, I would send those folks links to google some tutorial. Still some engineers would inherit code from a colleague who left. Then they would give it to me to maintain.
Last, another duty of mine was creating accounts for users on a Linux environment. Many of these folks only had Windows experience. Am I supposed to hand-hold everyone and teach them how to use Linux? No, that is their responsibility. But still many users expected a lot of hand holding because they had no clue how Linux works.
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
I also know of one person person with high IQ who was laid off for "It ain't my job" attitude and eventually hung himself.
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
To be fair, you made what appeared to be a full disclosure that may be the truth for many, but that to which many would not admit, in what I assumed to be an earnest desire to get some real advice. I hope you do get along better at your new post. My experience is that self awareness goes a long distance in providing contentment, regardless of what I am doing. Not a cure all, but a big help. I would also only start worrying about whose job was what if my schedule was full and it was necessary for optimizing my schedule. In a situation like what you described from your past, it sounds like you had plenty of time to hold hands. If that is the case, then yes, you should hold hands. If you are booked up with work, then you have to start prioritizing who gets your help and who doesn't.
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
I'm sure you are a smart guy and your perception is accurate. Even so, it might be worth while to exercising some compassion to those you intact with. As jari001 said "their success is your success". You may think they are not deserving of it but there can be sincere satisfaction in helping those who are capable as well as those who are not.
Good luck in your new job.
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
I think this is the mindset you need to adapt when you build your personal strategies. Let me be more clear: Your survival is at play.
If you do not develop awareness / readiness to face next steps in a context that has turned 180 degree opposite to what you are used to then all the aggressive/unforgivable/harsh features of the upcoming journey will knock you out.
You are asking what should I do to get less wet when there will be another rain shower... I am saying you need to build barricades, erect strong walls and have fall backs and exit plans in place to prepare for the big flood!
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
It's a dog-eat-dog world out there but a predominant scarcity mindset is detrimental. To come back from multiple setbacks you listed, I believe it's better to have a growth mindset to accept and seek to do things better. Happiness in life can coexist in a merciless environment.
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
Sometimes, things are not your department. A good case can be made for not explaining FEA to idiots. How was it decided what level of qualification your co-workers had with FEA, coding and Linux? Who was responsible for providing the original training to everyone? If you don't like providing support, you should work at providing support.
When my duties included the administration of a UNIX network, I spent a lot of downtime writing manuals and other instructions. When you are busy and you want to tell them to RTFM, you need an FM!
--
JHG
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
Cheers
Greg Locock
New here? Try reading these, they might help FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
I realize that I'm probably talking about MAJOR personality changes. But you asked in a forthright manner, so I will answer in the same way.
One other thing that struck me is that you seemed to spend a lot of time trying to avoid work, and seemed proud when you did so. I would not be proud of that. If you don't enjoy your work, find some you do.
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
If you respect someone's knowledge and ability, they are not idiots.
--
JHG
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
I still have issues with helping people who really need to help themselves. It makes me cringe to see someone with a bachelors degree doing complex FEA/CFD. It's part of a growing trend of "democratization" of simulation.
In university one has to take pre-requisites before they let you enroll in an advanced class. No professor is going to hold your hand to teach you things you are expected to know. Why in corporate world is it any different?
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
Further, some of the damn software has 'engineer' in the name, so that must be what it does, at least according to MBAs.
Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
So, if a significant proportion of your customers request basic support put together a solution. I created a wiki that attempts to capture all of the weirder aspects of doing my job (not in FEA).
As to whether you need anything beyond a BEng to run FEA, that rather depends on what you are doing. A far greater danger is FEA analysts who believe the model is right and the test result is wrong, or who have little physical understanding of the system in question. My background is in experimental modal analysis, to reveal my prejudices.
Cheers
Greg Locock
New here? Try reading these, they might help FAQ731-376: Eng-Tips.com Forum Policies http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
The hand holding that you don't like is actually somewhat engineering related. I don't like holding unnecessary hands either, but my complaints come from doing Sourcing's job or Application Engineering's job when I know that they could / should do the job themselves. It really overloads me. I try to give solutions to their teams, but get overridden by terrible management. (I'm taking a break from work right now to calm down due to my stress. I needed a relaxer)
However, I'm always open for actual training sessions IF the participants are going to use the knowledge in the future.. sort of the "teach a man to fish' thing.
Plus, I think it's a piss poor attitude to suggest that learning software is just learning what happens when you type 'xyz'. A lot of actual / practical knowledge is 'the results tend fall on the conservative side with this software' or 'the best way we found to get accurate results to is to do this..'. That's the reason you're paid well. Not because you can repeat the Help menu by heart.
Maybe I misunderstand your job though.. (I personally think FEA should be something I (BSME) sub out to a FEA specialist, but that's a different story)
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg
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RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
1. was it because you were working from home?
2. not enough proactive interaction with your 'laid back' bosses?
etc.etc.
for every role I was involved in, my goal would be to find what sort of metrics i would be compared against, and what targets that are internally set for me to meet and exceed. in a general support role - it'd be difficult, but possible. have you thought about finding the key measures of your own success (or derive some), and discuss this in a recurring sense with your manager?
I'd say part of process metrics and people metrics would be good for you to think about for your next role.
https://www.clearpointstrategy.com/18-key-performa...
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
https://www.clearpointstrategy.com/18-key-performa..."
Process metrics, people metrics, scorecards...
Real recipe for disaster...:)
Take it easy, just kidding a bit :)
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
Best regards, Morten
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
I'd also recommend being very careful regarding "its not my job." While I understand your previous situation having dealt with many similarly clueless engineers myself (teaching CFD actually), that's typically not viewed as a good answer unless the extra responsibility is truly monumental AND the magnitude of the work is clearly communicated/understood. No doubt you've run into that bc in your example some folks are clueless about FEA complexity and the breadth of required knowledge, the key is politely helping them to understand the absurdity of their request for you to teach it.
Good luck either way.
RE: Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past?
A friend of mine worked a software help desk but learned, after many years, that he didn't like it. He wanted to teach. He just graduated with his Ph.D. in Computer Science and is now teaching. Maybe you need to find something you really enjoy and go after it.
And remember, people applying the software are in the trenches doing work. If you were one of them, your vantage point may be more like theirs rather than the Subject Matter Expert.
And, if you want to connect with others, you have to be interested in them, too. There is a hint of "not enough in common" on your part, with your peers. They'll get it.
Good luck with the new job.
Pamela K. Quillin, P.E.
Quillin Engineering, LLC