Discovery of Undersized Members
Discovery of Undersized Members
(OP)
If a structural element, say a wooden window header, is slightly undersized (say 5% overstress under design load) and nobody catches it; the building is constructed, CO approved; can a building inspector legally come back in (say 10 years later) and require the element to be upgraded? If so, what provisions in the code would allow him to do this?
I ask because I run into situations where a building is damaged and is being repaired under the IEBC building code, and in many situations the IEBC says you can repair it to it's pre-damaged condition unless it's a dangerous condition. Sometimes the repair work exposes non-damaged elements that are slightly undersized. I'm trying to determine if the IEBC or the original design code would apply.
I ask because I run into situations where a building is damaged and is being repaired under the IEBC building code, and in many situations the IEBC says you can repair it to it's pre-damaged condition unless it's a dangerous condition. Sometimes the repair work exposes non-damaged elements that are slightly undersized. I'm trying to determine if the IEBC or the original design code would apply.






RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
You can however, use any means available to make it calc out. Sometimes the answer comes down to, what's the repair cost worth, versus what's the cost of proving the as-built condition is adequate.
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
If you discover an I-joist that has a hole larger than what is permitted, I would assume you should repair it. That falls in the category of not safe per the manufacturer most likely. If a beam in its current state is 5% or less over stressed, I probably wouldn't lose too much sleep over it as you are repairing to original state.
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
In fact, some recent versions of the IEBC go as far as defining that overstress up to 133% is not dangerous. Newer versions give the judgement to the engineer.
My question is, would it be legal for the building official come back in way after the CO is given and enforce the original new construction code, since its no longer adopted, i'm not sure how they could, but am curious if anyone else has thought about this.
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
Just to clarify, that is NOT what the IEBC says. The IEBC says if it would comply to the code at the time of design or last alteration/repair/addition, then it doesn't need to be upgraded (with exceptions). Are you working on an alteration, addition, or repair? That also determines what needs to be done.
If the floor joist were damaged during installation and wouldn't calc out at the time of design, it should be repaired.
Go Bucks!
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
What's the whole story here?
Are we talking about strengthening something or repairing something?
Are we talking about a building that has been damaged? Or an inspector with an axe to grind?
If you're talking about repairing an existing building that has been damaged, IEBC `15 602.1 states, "Materials already in use in a building in compliance with requirements or approvals in effect at the time of their erection or installation shall be permitted to remain in use unless determined by the code official to render the building or structure unsafe or dangerous..."
and dangerous is defined, in part, as, "there exists a significant risk of collapse, detachment, or dislodgement of any portion, member, (etc)... under service loads".
It sounds to me like the inspector is well within his rights to require repairs not related to the original damage. Your argument would lie in whether or not a condition is dangerous.
IE, a window header 5% overstressed is not dangerous. One joist that was drilled out 15 years ago probably isn't dangerous.
If you're talking about something aside from a repair to an existing building, hopefully you can clarify your circumstances.
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
I would say yes, if there is a defect, and it is discovered, of course the building official can insist it be corrected. Under what authority? The ordinances passed by the municipality making him the building official.
Isn't that the building official's job in the first place, to ensure the users of that building are not put in harm's way?
Maybe your question is really "do I have to say anything if I discover this old construction defect." That's a different question entirely.
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
RE: Discovery of Undersized Members
If a floor joist (beam) is drilled through, then you go to the floor above and post a sign saying "Floor loads limited to 10 tons per square yard." The "understrength" joist is now fully capable of holding the "reduced load" on the floor AS ACTUALLY IN PLACE.
A "live load" extrapolation from "assumed" live loads and "assumed" operating conditions can be eliminated by eliminating the condition that creates the overload. Even if "no load" can be put on that floor over that joist? Then paint the floor yellow and barricade it off.